No don’t you understand? All countries are capitalist which means all countries are imperialist which means they are all exactly equal and there’s no stance we can ever take on anything because it’s all the same
The working man has no country. From an orthodox marxist or left communist perspective it does actually make sense to say all countries are invalid and a pox on both their houses. They are, however, not doing that. They're condemning the individual casualties of the IDF while ignoring the mass murder of Palestinians.
The working man had the Soviets, and the loss of those nations has resulted in a massive global loss of worker rights and power. The labor movement has never been stronger than when the USSR was at its zenith, and it has never been weaker than after its destruction.
These ultras can yap all the twisted and contorted “theory” they like, but if at the end of the day their conclusion of the Cold War was “both sides are the same, neither should be supported” then they are just in flat denial of reality and their ideas are laughably naive. The USSR was better. Even if it doesn’t fit their ideal definition of socialism exactly it was better than the imperialist west, and their failure to agree to that makes them extremely suspect
The working man has no country is from the communist manifesto. It is from a fairly basic section about how the communists/workers owes no allegiance to any particular country or nationality, but only to each other across the entire world.
It is from this principle that Lenin derived his thoughts about ww1.
During the time if the manifesto, there were no successful examples of socialism. After the establishment of the ussr, this changes. The strongest force of revolution becomes the Republic of the Soviets.
other socialist nations still exist, and it's our duty to oppose attacks against them by capitalist nations. In addition, it's our revolutionary defeatist duty to first and foremost oppose our own empire and nation. The "both sides" aloof and above it all position of ultras who flatten everything is fundamentally wrong. To espouse such a flattening of everything is nihilism and anti-communist and counter revolutionary. They don't sit above history, they reside within it. They don't sit in a nationless throne atop of the world, they live as workers in the imperial core.
Trots and ultras suffer from very similar disorders, both stemming from chauvinism and opportunism. These types of left coms are basically turbo-trots, if you took everything wrong with them and turned it up to 11 and added a very jaded and cynical aloof edge to it. Trots are often sincere and try to do things (too many things sometimes), whereas these types are terminally online and have flowed much further down the cynical pipeline and are justifying their own superiority complex and laziness
Yeah it's definitely not exclusive to them, but they're the only ones with any offline presence that I see this from locally. And again, not all of them, trots are interesting because they range from totally reasonable to complete cranks. But I guess you could say that of anyone.
I'm actually optimistic now that all sectarian labels are becoming less important even among those that would normally claim them for themselves. Locally I see lots of Trotsky-enjoyers who would have previously claimed the name and are now looking to build something broader than any specific label. Which is more or less where I am politically as well.
No don’t you understand? All countries are capitalist which means all countries are imperialist which means they are all exactly equal and there’s no stance we can ever take on anything because it’s all the same
The working man has no country. From an orthodox marxist or left communist perspective it does actually make sense to say all countries are invalid and a pox on both their houses. They are, however, not doing that. They're condemning the individual casualties of the IDF while ignoring the mass murder of Palestinians.
The working man had the Soviets, and the loss of those nations has resulted in a massive global loss of worker rights and power. The labor movement has never been stronger than when the USSR was at its zenith, and it has never been weaker than after its destruction.
These ultras can yap all the twisted and contorted “theory” they like, but if at the end of the day their conclusion of the Cold War was “both sides are the same, neither should be supported” then they are just in flat denial of reality and their ideas are laughably naive. The USSR was better. Even if it doesn’t fit their ideal definition of socialism exactly it was better than the imperialist west, and their failure to agree to that makes them extremely suspect
The working man has no country is from the communist manifesto. It is from a fairly basic section about how the communists/workers owes no allegiance to any particular country or nationality, but only to each other across the entire world.
It is from this principle that Lenin derived his thoughts about ww1.
During the time if the manifesto, there were no successful examples of socialism. After the establishment of the ussr, this changes. The strongest force of revolution becomes the Republic of the Soviets.
I have some news for you about the Soviet Union. Even if this had been a relevant commentary, there is no soviet union, no country of the working man
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Which was written before the revolution… in which the working man gained a country
I have some bad news about the Soviet Union
other socialist nations still exist, and it's our duty to oppose attacks against them by capitalist nations. In addition, it's our revolutionary defeatist duty to first and foremost oppose our own empire and nation. The "both sides" aloof and above it all position of ultras who flatten everything is fundamentally wrong. To espouse such a flattening of everything is nihilism and anti-communist and counter revolutionary. They don't sit above history, they reside within it. They don't sit in a nationless throne atop of the world, they live as workers in the imperial core.
A lot of trots have improved, but easily 30% will still argue this.
None of the people involved here are trots. You are being sectarian just to fit in.
Trots and ultras suffer from very similar disorders, both stemming from chauvinism and opportunism. These types of left coms are basically turbo-trots, if you took everything wrong with them and turned it up to 11 and added a very jaded and cynical aloof edge to it. Trots are often sincere and try to do things (too many things sometimes), whereas these types are terminally online and have flowed much further down the cynical pipeline and are justifying their own superiority complex and laziness
This is essentially sectarian word salad.
it's all entirely correct descriptions of trends in western leftoid thought
Yeah it's definitely not exclusive to them, but they're the only ones with any offline presence that I see this from locally. And again, not all of them, trots are interesting because they range from totally reasonable to complete cranks. But I guess you could say that of anyone.
I'm actually optimistic now that all sectarian labels are becoming less important even among those that would normally claim them for themselves. Locally I see lots of Trotsky-enjoyers who would have previously claimed the name and are now looking to build something broader than any specific label. Which is more or less where I am politically as well.