How many emails will it take to get "Russia!"... three

We don't know yet but fraud is on the table. There was so much Russian interference and free-fall for them on X and then with America PAC, which should have been a GOTV campaign but turned into a paying people off for votes until (?) the justice department warned Musk. But they went undercover or just stopped?

Voters made a statement but until we have a full security overview of this election, we won't know if it's the people's will or the will of foreign adversaries.

There's some sanity in the thread:

I would caution against the message or notion that there was a material impact of foreign efforts until more is known. It robs Trump voters of their agency, ignores their real fears about cost of living and social issues, and wasn't an effective message last time.

There was a great quote I read from post 2016 done by some deep research, I can't remember who wrote it and I'm paraphrasing as I heard it at a lecture in 2017: "Trump voters have a sense they've been waiting in line their entire lives for a slice of the American dream, and they're not where they thought they'd be in life. They feel like they're working hard, playing by the rules, and they're owed something by society. They see progressive policies as giving benefits to other people, which effectively is allowing them to cut in line, and get access to the American dream they don't have. They want those policies to stop, and they're willing to blow up the system to make it happen."

Lots of women in the thread think it all boils down to sexism. "Kamala lost because she's a woman."

CW: SA

spoiler

Bingo — men secretly, and not so secretly, hate women being in ANY kind of leadership position or exercising ANY kind of autonomy. It’s threatening — fires up the lizard brain. And lizard brain is where bad shit happens.

This hate either manifests itself overtly, for example, via the emails I received as a Kamala staffer: “FUCK YOU YOU STUPID WHORE I HOPE YOU GETremovedD WITH KNIVES YOU FUCKING CUM BUCKET BITCH” — I got so many of these, and sent from real email accounts — WORK EMAIL ACCOUNTS — at SCHOOLS!

Or, the more sinister manifestation: “I just don’t know her policies” “Have you googled to find them or gone to the website?” “No.” If Kamala were a man, he would have automatically been granted a minimal respect just for being a dude. A confident woman? Hmm, something’s not right here.

Then there's stuff like this:

Early exit polling data suggests that Joe Biden received a higher share of the women’s vote than both Kamala Harris and Hillary Clinton did in their respective presidential runs, by at least 3 percentage points.

More broadly, the party’s persistent push to shift rightward has not proven to be a winning strategy. The Democratic base is energized by BOLD, progressive policies, not by chasing endorsements from neocon, right-wing, warhawks like Dick Cheney. This drive to appeal to a “center” often ignores that many independent voters aren’t inherently centrists. They’re driven by issues that demand clear positions, not ideological compromise.

This was a challenging election cycle for Democrats, partly because they didn’t hold a primary to choose the strongest candidate. The Democratic Party needs to return to its principles and embrace a true primary process, so that the most popular candidates emerge, rather than consolidating against enormously popular candidates like Bernie Sanders and Elizabeth Warren

Are the libs learning? Welcome to another look inside Lib Land. Anything specific you want me to share?

  • MayoPete [he/him, comrade/them]
    ·
    7 days ago

    This thread is maddening. You all are in DC or wherever you are, have you canvassed lately? Have you made phone calls? Have you talked to your neighbors? We are in a completely different world and we are all acting like Dems in 2016. We can intellectualize the polls or whatever we think is happening, but it seems like you all don't know what's happening in Idaho, or Alaska or Iowa or South Carolina. Y'all, this is why we lose. Consultants and political people who think they know but never talk to the people. I really want you to talk to your neighbors, and then get back to me. Not rich neighbors, real people. This is why we lose - Gen Z is not having the Democratic Party and I don't blame them. This isn't a hard conversation, it's really simple. Have a better candidate, we win. I want to win, and the people we put up lately are bad. That's simply it. We need to get back to talking about what we can do for regular people, and not the most lethal military in the world.