- cross-posted to:
- globalnews@lemmy.zip
- cross-posted to:
- globalnews@lemmy.zip
Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky has urged Western leaders to pressure Russia into peace using "all means" necessary.
Mr Zelensky has long said he will not negotiate with Russia directly until Moscow's forces leave all Ukrainian territory, including Crimea.
His call, however, comes as Russia makes gains against Ukraine, with Kyiv suffering from a shortage of Western-supplied weapons.
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Hello Biden, it’s Zelensky. We need 5 billion rockets to bomb Donetsk children. Slava Ukraina
should've thought of that two years ago in Istanbul when peace was on the table
They were all high on hopium back then and had convinced themselves Ukraine could beat Russia. lol
Is there still a chance for peace talks even after being rejected? I’d assume that its still on the table since it would certainly be good for both Russia and Ukraine.
It's just going to be Russia dictating terms at this point. Two years ago, there were actual talks happening where Ukraine was able to make demands of their own. Also, Russia said that they won't negotiate with Zelensky because his term is expired, and they don't see him as a legitimate legal entity now.
Well that's going to be interesting.
My money is on Russia installing a leader that has their interests at heart.
That seems like the most likely outcome. Russia will get a friendly regime in whatever is left of Ukraine.
Probably, but not nearly as favorable terms as it would have been a couple years ago. Not only have the positions changed a lot, but a lot of lives have been lost and the western powers have shown themselves to be untrustworthy time and again. That said, the terms are only going to get worse every day that goes by.
I can't begin to speculate on what would be acceptable terms. A big issue I see is that any treaty drafted by the western powers wouldn't be worth the paper it was written on, we already know that they never had any intention of honoring their prior agreements.
Russia was ready to make peace at the start of this thing but Zelenskyy let himself be dogwalked into rejecting the talks. Now he’s crying because he realizes that backing out of the Istanbul meeting was a huge mistake and maybe the west doesn’t have Ukraine’s best interest at heart. But even with the knowledge that the west is the worst ally one can have, he is still begging them for help, to the point where it looks like he’s calling for something horrible to happen in Russia (i.e. nukes). I don’t know what Putin’s stance is right now but maybe he’s still up for peace negotiations even after being rejected time and time again…
I don’t know what Putin’s stance is right now but maybe he’s still up for peace negotiations even after being rejected time and time again…
Putin is absolutely interested in negotiations if the constant statements from himself, his foreign minister, Russian media, etc are any indications. They just have to respect Russia's original wants + the changing battlefield and the reality on the ground.
In practice that means:
- Ukraine has to cede the break-away regions in the east that Russia legally incorporated.
- Has to cede and recognize Crimea being Russian.
- Has to agree to never join NATO.
- Has to agree to disarmament. (Including a likely ask of a large cordon sanitaire that precludes any military force with rocket/long range capabilities being deployed within striking range of old Russian regions at a minimum)
- And has to agree to stop persecuting Russians, Russian speakers, etc and to take steps to denazify itself.
Might be a few other things but that's the gist of it. Other than the expanded cordon sanitaire that Putin wants after years of terrorist attacks deep into Russia with western missiles and the recognition of the eastern break-away territories which Putin was willing to see Ukraine maintained at the early peace talks in exchange for fair treatment of minorities the demands are basically the same as they've always been. It's just the Ukrainian bargaining position has gotten much worse and after expending so much blood and treasure Russia is not going to budge on the territorial realities or on disarming them because they don't want to have this fight again after all the tricks they've been subjected to in the past.
Problem is, Ukraine and EU violated every previous agreement with blatant premeditation and bad faith. Nobody should blame Russia for not trusting their words and papers anymore. Every further negotiation would be from the position of strenght.
Except now NATO has been disarmed (at least in Europe) - their stocks have been emptied and they have neither the industrial capacity nor the resources to produce the armaments; also - Ukraine has been bled dry, its infrastructure severely damaged, its remaining industry turned into rubble, and the most painful part - its non-Nazi people - those who weren't interested in fighting, those who were kidnapped off the streets - sacrificed on the altar of Western capitalism/imperialism as cannon fodder. There's not a lot of leeway to wiggle anymore
Zelenskyy is just a puppet on a string, he does what he's told or he'll be replaced. He also has a wife and children to think about. He's basically a hostage at this point. Doesn't excuse his behaviour, of course, but it does help to explain why he'd be behaving so rabidly.
Mr Zelensky has long said he will not negotiate with Russia directly until Moscow’s forces leave all Ukrainian territory, including Crimea.
I can see why he isn't holding elections; this is a ludicrous position that can do nothing but get more of his people killed and maimed.
I don't think it's up to him, I think the neo-nazis in Ukraine are the ones with actual power.
Well whoever's in charge, their only hope is that the US starts launching nukes at Russia to take the heat off of them because no sane person thinks the winning force is going to peacefully surrender.
Bold words from someone losing a war. I guess the unelected dictator is too prideful to admit that this can't go on much longer.
This isn't anything new, this is exact the same demand of unconditional withdrawal as always, just with more desperate and whiny wording than usual.
I sincerely believe Zelensky was threatened by the neo-nazis not to surrender, ever. I remember vaguely that in the beginning of the war his wife was not in public view, I think she was abducted/held by the neo-nazis to make sure he doesn't leave. I don't think Zelensky has any agency or say in this matter. He does what he is told, all of the stuff about him being like Churchill is just PR.
I definitely agree that there is some coercion taking place, though it would be pure speculation for me to guess it was nazi elements in the Ukrainian government. Absolutely could be, I wouldn't be surprised, though my money is on his western overlords forcing him to stay in the war. Maybe with the carrot on a stick of NATO membership. The timing of Boris Johnson's visit just seems to line up so perfectly.
it would be pure speculation for me to guess it was nazi elements in the Ukrainian government
Why do they have to be in government? Nazis have taken over policing in major cities, they effectively run the streets. Many Ukrainians are leaving the country cause they don't want to live in places controlled by Nazis.
Oh they wouldn't have to be in government, though there are undoubtedly those elements there and probably have the easiest access.
The reality is probably some combination of both, to be honest.
Edit: Also, what happened to your presidential term, my guy?
