Took a little break from the internet and touched some grass and it was great. Wander back in here after my hiatus and what do I find? Just a thread with a bunch of fatphobia.
Cute.
For a community that is incredibly careful about protecting its users from the -phobias and the -isms, there sure is a hell of a lot of unchecked fatphobia here basically any time fatness gets brought up.
It’s something I’ve noticed on the left in general as well. The leftist org I’m in has almost no fat people in it and something tells me that’s not because there aren’t any fat leftists out there.
Fatphobia is rooted in anti-Blackness and ableism.
I’d highly recommend the “Maintenance Phase” podcast with Michael Hobbes and Aubrey Gordon, as well as Aubrey Gordon’s books “What We Don’t Talk About When We Talk About Fat” and “You Just Need To Lose Weight.”
TL;DR: There’s mounting evidence that anti-fat bias in medicine is more to blame for poor medical outcomes in fat people rather than just the fat itself.
Diet and exercise don’t result in long-term weight loss for something like 95% of people. As a leftist, are you really gonna sit here and blame this on individual choices rather than systemic issues? Are you really gonna try to convince us that 95% of people are just lacking willpower?
Please note that this thread is not an invitation to convince me I’m wrong or share your own personal anecdotal story of successful long-term weight loss with the implication that others can do it because you did it. This post is a request that any thin person (or thin-adjacent person) reading this who wants to argue about how being fat is bad for your health do some research and some self-crit. This post is a request that this community rethink the way it engages with discussions about fatness, diet, fatphobia, and anti-fat bias.
Anti-fat bias literally kills people.
I understand being overweight is a systematic and structural situation, I understand everyone is free to possess their body in whichever form they are comfortable in and nobody should receive unsolicited advice or unrequired criticism regarding their bodily autonomy, I understand at every turn there are circumstances beyond one's own control and responsibility regarding weight and weight loss. I also understand that it can be difficult to diet and exercise even if one is actively trying to lose weight and nobody is obliged to lose weight in the first place if they don't feel they need to. I also have seen examples of institutional and medical fatphobia on top of widespread fatphobia in popular cultural and media in general. I see all the time people give unsolicited advice with personal anecdotes independent of context of the interaction and abuse fat people receive just for existing and control others try to exert over their life and their situation.
However one thing that I don't understand here is the suggestion that being overweight doesn't cause any issues at all. I am not here to judge but it seems well-researched and readily apparent that being overweight is cause for great deal of health complications and losing weight can alleviate those complications that are caused by being overweight. This again is not a disagreement that there is fatphobia in medicine where people have their issues unrelated to weight or weight loss go untreated because any health issue is simply treated as caused by being overweight and fat people don't get same attention and care regarding their health by medical personnel. I am just simply not understanding how so much research regarding complications caused by being overweight can all be false independent of that. This is regarding specifically only things which weight loss has been documented to directly alleviate and no other correlational complications which may or may not be related to one's weight.
The reason I suggested the “Maintenance Phase” podcast is that they dive into a lot of the scientific “evidence” about how being fat is bad for you and suggest that anti-fat bias in medicine is actually the cause of poor health outcomes for fat people. And I do want to help people understand but it’s honestly exhausting to have the same conversations over and over.
Thank you. I am assuming her books also go over this topic? I tend to prefer reading over either listening or watching to acquire information for educational purposes and leave podcasts for entertainment only. I'll specifically check the books.
Does anyone suggest being overweight causes no issues? I don't think they do. (well, I'm sure some people do, cause anyone will say anything, but I don't think its a widespread view)
I think the argument is A) the issues are over-exaggerated and over-policed, B) we celebrate some other unhealthy behaviors (such as some aspects of weightlifting and professional sports, and some ED among the celebrity/model crowd), and C) so what if being overweight causes issues? Its not your body
I don't think they do [suggest being overweight causes no issues], but the well has been poisoned elsewhere by preemptively assuming that if we even present this as a societal issue and a negative outcome that we're 'concern trolling' and secretly only care because we hate fat people.
I grew up in Mississippi. Huge food desert, poor population, awful education, terribly obese, and the entire country is constantly being shitty to the people there like they chose it. And the healthcare sucks because doctors don't try to treat fat people. So sure, it's not my body, it's not a literal warzone, and there are other behaviors that need to die, but I have a lot of proximity to this and some of the people I've grown up with have essentially no mobility and are constantly having health scares. It's not just a 'so what' to me, these were my neighbors and the common perception is that they experienced some sort of moral failing and not that they are being exploited into an early grave. It's not my body, but I care about more than just my own body.
I don't agree.
Your second paragraph is true, yes. Though, I'd frame it more around 'health' than 'weight'. I'm not saying 'weight' has no impact on health, but the health is the important part of the equation to focus on (and, even there, 'health' can be a dog-whistle for fatphobia sometimes). It's that focus of 'fat=bad' that is the 'concern trolling'. You don't need to 'fix fatness', you need to fix all those other problems.
Its not a 'poisoned well' if someone is telling people their weight needs to be fixed pisses people off (even if it's framed as not their fault!), and it is understandable that others find such comments to read as concern trolling.
https://www.marquiselemercedes.com/read/food-deserts
I don't know how to explain to you that linking an accusation of fatphobia when I have been in this thread constantly defending fatness as 'not a moral failing,' lost family to fatphobia, and experienced assumed fatphobia from people who don't even know me is extremely patronizing.
I definitely agree that it's a topic that's overpoliced and there are certain unhealthy behaviors that are glorified. In particular I have been myself tired and critical of all the health influencer and social media information peddlers who specialize over health topics while being sensationalist and seem to made with aim of making people panic. In particular, bodybuilders and weightlifters being such an extensive part of this when it is precisely those that can promote behaviors that are unhealthy both mentally and physically is something I came to greatly dislike recently with my observation that so much information and advice regarding self-care being monopolized by lifters who may or may not be on substances not to even mention crooks and grifters selling things like carnivore diets and what not.
However it seems that there is an argument being made specifically that being overweight is not the cause of certain health complications ascribed to it, which I'll try to look up now.