Welcome again to everybody! Make yourself at home. Happy Hanukkah. In the time-honoured tradition of our cult, here is our weekly discussion thread.
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I still wouldn't classify them as part of the state; they may act in the interest of the state (knowingly or not), but they have no institutional power, even if those who are part of the state may use their institutional power to defend them in some cases. Cuba also has an extremely high level of gun ownership and its gun owners also act in the interest of the Cuban state (which is also in their own interest), but I wouldn't say they're part of it
I don't think any of us would argue that the government (meaning the president, the congress, etc.) is the state; it's just there to hide the fact that the big bourgeoisie is fundamentally in control
I’m not arguing that either. To expand on the idea of a state in an oligarchy, since power stems from the capitalist and not the official government body, then the concept of the state can extend beyond the law and (official) institutional power.
I think we can all agree on the fact that the propaganda apparatus is part of the state, including mainstream media, and is beyond official government control. However, as described by Edward Bernays, propaganda stretches beyond just print and electronic media, but also includes think tanks, special interest groups, and movements. Like the NRA, GOA, etc.
For example, you can’t say that the Cuban American lobby or the Zionist lobby isn’t part of the state. On the surface, they appear to be grassroots organizations, but they are propped up and given power by capitalists because they support capitalist interests, and in return, they influence the people through false narratives, and gives an excuse to justify reactionary domestic and foreign policy.
Mainstream media may not be directly controlled by the government, but it is controlled by the core of the state (the big bourgeoisie), which is not the case for the average gun owner. This is also more or less true for "non-governmental" organizations like lobby groups and think tanks. It ultimately depends on how wide a definition of "state" is used, but including every gun owner would mean that at least 30% of the population are part of the state, and (IMO) such an extremely broad definition doesn't seem very useful
Regardless of the exact definition of "state", we can certainly agree that the majority of USian gun owners are aligned with the interests of the state, whether they know it or not