I've found with a lot of ultras, they will say things that are technically true but are non-sequiturs, they aren't relevant to the central question of the argument, but you're put on the defensive to "debunk" them, and when you can't, because they are technically true, but sort of miss the forest for the trees. They use the same sort of logic as conspiracy theorists, where a huge pile of garbage evidence for their position substitutes for an actual direct answer to their question. The question of "is China socialist" is answered by "who holds political power in China?" not through examples of billionaires existing or corruption or them trading with capitalist nations or supporting governments that fight Maoist uprisings. A million bits of circumstantial evidence will never add up to the same thing as a single piece of direct evidence.
It's like bigfoot. It doesn't matter how many blurry photos or foot casts or recordings of random animal noises in the woods they have, the thing that proves bigfoot real is a real bigfoot. It's the same thing with China. It doesn't matter how many examples of some small thing that isn't "pure enough" for them, what matters is who holds political power in the country.
The trick is to not get pulled into their games, they aren't interested in challenging their ideas about China, which is why they ignore the big picture in favour of tiny little "examples" instead.
The only way you can beat them is to not waste your time with them. If you let them go on long enough, they will inevitably start spouting bullshit from the CIA sooner or later, and I think that really shows their true colours. They'd rather critically support the organisation that has done more to harm socialist movements in the world than any other rather than critically support a socialist nation that doesn't pass their purity tests. They're western chauvinists at their core, even if they refuse to admit it.
I've found with a lot of ultras, they will say things that are technically true but are non-sequiturs, they aren't relevant to the central question of the argument, but you're put on the defensive to "debunk" them, and when you can't, because they are technically true, but sort of miss the forest for the trees. They use the same sort of logic as conspiracy theorists, where a huge pile of garbage evidence for their position substitutes for an actual direct answer to their question. The question of "is China socialist" is answered by "who holds political power in China?" not through examples of billionaires existing or corruption or them trading with capitalist nations or supporting governments that fight Maoist uprisings. A million bits of circumstantial evidence will never add up to the same thing as a single piece of direct evidence.
It's like bigfoot. It doesn't matter how many blurry photos or foot casts or recordings of random animal noises in the woods they have, the thing that proves bigfoot real is a real bigfoot. It's the same thing with China. It doesn't matter how many examples of some small thing that isn't "pure enough" for them, what matters is who holds political power in the country.
The trick is to not get pulled into their games, they aren't interested in challenging their ideas about China, which is why they ignore the big picture in favour of tiny little "examples" instead.
The only way you can beat them is to not waste your time with them. If you let them go on long enough, they will inevitably start spouting bullshit from the CIA sooner or later, and I think that really shows their true colours. They'd rather critically support the organisation that has done more to harm socialist movements in the world than any other rather than critically support a socialist nation that doesn't pass their purity tests. They're western chauvinists at their core, even if they refuse to admit it.