what with all these white jewish people in the imperial core who suddenly just NEED to go live in the middle east and commit war crimes and genocide along the way? Just... go buy a house in Arizona or something if you REALLY want to live in the desert? These people who are moving into Israel presumably had a place to live before moving across the planet. Why do they specifically need to move to Israel of all places? Who the fuck is waking up in the morning thinking "I need to murder brown children so I can live in that very specific bit of desert on the other side of the world"?

  • triangle [none/use name]
    ·
    edit-2
    3 years ago

    Like all things, comrade, economic relations and the base comes first - then the social relations and superstructure flows from that.

    Who are the settlers in Palestine? The poor and dispossessed from Israel and from around the world. Of course they are, these neighborhoods arent exactly safe or nice AND they're often subsidized directly or indirectly by the state or ngo's. The poor move in there because Israel proper is getting priced out. Same thing happened with settlers in America and Canada. They even gave land for FREE to settlers in western Canada (provided they cleared the forest on it within a year or something).

    The poor move there because they have to, because they're driven by economics. That doesnt make what they do forgivable or right, but if you want to understand why its happening and begin to figure out how to stop it you must understand the base and economic reasons it exists. Plus, all that violence is abstract enough - the IDF and police handle it all, the settlers never have to actually see it or do it.

    In the end, we can solve this when the Israelis and the settlers realize they have more in common with the Palestinians they're displacing than they do with bourgeoisie that are depriving them of shelter and wealth back home, even though they may share a religious faith with those bourgeois. If some critical mass figures that out, we can break this system like a dry twig and there can finally begin an actual peace process and reconciliation and justice in the middle east.

    • Bluegrass_Buddhist [none/use name]
      ·
      edit-2
      3 years ago

      Who are the settlers in Palestine? The poor and dispossessed from Israel and from around the world.

      Is this really the case though? I know there are some Israeli Haredi groups (with members living below the poverty line) that sponsor settlers, but I've also known some perfectly comfortable Americans that move out near Bethlehem.

      Some of the settlements have pretty comfortable conditions even by U.S. standards, and even as nearby Palestinian neighborhoods still have to ration daily water.

      • kulak_inspektor [comrade/them]
        ·
        3 years ago

        It's still an economic motivator to go there, since they get benefits from the state of Israel. If Israel didnt provide tangible benefits to people, like stolen housing, then no one would be moving there

      • triangle [none/use name]
        ·
        3 years ago

        The cheaper price of the settlements comes partially from benefits but also its less valuable land because you're under threat of counter attack. There's a premium on distance from those tensions within Israel. The settlers get benefits to move out. I'm sure there are plenty of ideological settlers that go so that in some potential peace deal they can grab up the land, but I'd bet a significant majority are poor or downwardly mobile and are attracted primarily to: the cheap rents and the subsidies Israel gives to settlers,

        If you're not ideological and from America , you don't go to a settlement unless you're poor. You move to a regular neighborhood in Israel. It's just not worth the risk or the tension to be in a settlement if you can afford an apartment or house normally.

    • Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her]
      hexagon
      ·
      3 years ago

      I thought Israel was a fairly comfortable place with air conditioning and other amenities you would expect in an imperial core area. Though come to think of it, I honestly have no idea what day to day life is even like in Israel, I just assumed it was rather cushy

      • triangle [none/use name]
        ·
        3 years ago

        Comfortable but under tension and possible counter attack. You pay extra for DISTANCE from that in the west and Israel. Listen to real estate agents when they sell you stuff on youtube or whatever, they sell you distance from tension.

        • Ho_Chi_Chungus [she/her]
          hexagon
          ·
          3 years ago

          With those pictures surfacing the other day of Israeli citizens watching Palestine getting leveled by artillery fire in fucking lawn chairs cheering it on, I didn't exactly think your average Israeli citizen was that fearful of how far they are from danger

      • SiskoDid2ThingsWrong [none/use name]
        ·
        3 years ago

        I thought Israel was a fairly comfortable place with air conditioning and other amenities you would expect in an imperial core area.

        It is but it also has an insane cost of living. Rents and real estate costs in Israel proper are crazy high right now. The new settlements being thrown up in Palestinian land are cheap McMansions for people who can’t afford anything near Tel Aviv.