I'm currently at home and thus forced to learn about all the latest right media trends on Fox which plays all day.
In short, the story is that the girlfriend of the victim, Austin Simon, had a declined transaction. She went and got her boyfriend for whatever reason, he had some kind of confrontation with the man at the counter, Jose Alba, and Simon was eventually stabbed to death.
I've seen this mostly covered by conservative outlets and "JusticePorn" type social media, and they're all basically supporting the Alba. Also including Eric Adams, who has criticized the decision to charge the guy with murder - NYT.
I linked the most complete video I could find of the incident. To me, it looks like Alba is shoved once by Simon pretty hard, and he then yells at him for a bit before pulling him up from the chair he was shoved into and looks like he's going to march him out in front of the counter, which is the point at which Alba grabs the knife, whips around, and stabs him: at least 5 times according to reports and you can see a stab to the neck in the video.
Additionally, from the NYT article, according to Alba, Simon "had demanded that he 'come apologize to the girl,'" which I think tracks with leading him out from behind the counter maybe. Simon also did not have a weapon.
To me, this seems like a disproportionate response, and I can see why he would be charged, but I wanted to know other's thoughts. I feel like you shouldn't be able to kill people over relatively minor altercations when your life isn't immediately threatened but that's just me lol.
If you attack someone weaker than you, anything they do to become stronger than you is valid in my opinion. Cornering an old man is assaulting the weakest demographic you can find in the hope that they can't fight back. The old man tried to get away and was restrained from doing so prompting the stabbing. Fuck around and find out.
The criminal charge is absurd to me. It's clear self-defense after he's grabbed.
I mean I agree it's definitely fucked up to harass an older person just doing their job like that, but like, going straight to knife in the neck over it? Just feels bad to me. I'm not much of a fighter though and I've never really been in a situation like that.
i mean, imagine if it was an elderly woman. would that color your opinion?
im tiny as fuck and have been attacked by people way bigger than me, if you dont go for the incredible violence option you will have terrible things happen to you. being a short elderly person of any gender vs. a tall young person thats backing you into a corner is not gonna lead to good things, especially with how quick elderly people can break bones. remember that protest video of that old guy getting shoved over by police? he was hospitalized for a month or so and was deaf in a ear or something
i agree that someone shouldnt be murdered over petty theft, but someone shouldnt be threatened with potential extreme violence in the commission of petty theft either. thieves should remember that
So, I know the post I linked calls him a robber, but from what I've read the confrontation was over the clerk taking back some item from his girlfriend's daughter after her EBT card was declined. You can also see Simon close the cash register in the video, he didn't have a weapon, and it just generally doesn't seem like his intent was to rob him and the clerk himself said that what Simon wanted was an apology, not that I agree with his method of getting one.
I definitely understand the fear here. He doesn't know the guy who's yelling at him or his intentions, and he's being rough. And as others here have said, if you choose to respond to that aggression with force like the clerk here did, it's difficult to control where it ends. I guess I just feel like the clerk shouldn't have escalated it further; give the guy what he wants and be done with it.
I'm empathetic to the clerk though and I don't think he should do 25 years or whatever for murder over this.
i dont consider the clerk to have escalated anything. the guy escalated the situation into a physical confrontation over something trivial like a card being declined. if you really need food, just take it and leave.
that's fair
If he threw a punch it would get him killed. If he threatened with a knife, he doesn't have the space and would be killed. If he threatened without a knife, he'll be killed. Trying to escape is his attempt at deescalation and it was denied. The assaulter chose his victim and he chose wrong. Vulnerable people with the means to defend themselves is a thing I support in general and especially when someone a third of your age is already committing to that degree of violence against you.
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intimidation, provocation, escalation, knife
Have you ever been in a fight? Like a real fight with a stranger that you don't know? Things happen very, very fast. You don't have time to do a lot of critical thinking, especially when someone already has control over you and is about to do who knows what. You have time to react, and you can and should use overwhelming violence to protect yourself. The legal idea of "proportionate response" is usually nonsense. There's no proportionate response to being grabbed by someone bigger than you. They could easily bounce your head off the pavement until you died. And you have no idea of knowing whether they mean to hurt your or just scare the shit out of you. You have to assume the worst.
This isn't to say you should jump straight to killing people; If you can you should deescalate or try to run away. But a lot of times that isn't a realistic option - There's no where to run, or you're surrounded, or someone is obviously faster than you.
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I'm pretty surprised in this thread by how many responses could have been written by Massad Ayoub. Or any Texan.
How many serious fights have you been in?
That's exactly what Massad Ayoub would say. :(
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