What do you think of The Condition of the Working Class in England? I think it can be very dry in some parts but its still definitely one of my favourite books, pretty sure it was one of the first left wing books I read.
It's very good. I think every socialist should read it. I think it works great as an audiobook, which isn't true for most theory books. The level of suffering is hard to imagine. It's helpful I think to read this book in tandem with Planet of Slums. Because when you bring up the book to any lib or chud, their response every time is that "sure things were bad back then but it's better - capitalism lifts all boats!" Planet of Slums clearly outlines how all that misery has just been outsourced to the global south.
I have only two very mild criticisms of Engels. And they aren't really criticisms even, just things I wish he'd included.
He always brings up data points like "there are 2,000 workers employed in nail factories in Wigan"... but he never really gives a sense of perspective regarding how large the working class is in relation to other classes. Were they the majority at that time? A large minority? Engels never says. The absolute numbers are useful and have their place but I wish he wouldn't solely rely on them.
I wish he would have done more to explain how, it is very possible if not likely that workers had a better life under earlier stages of capitalism and/or feudalism
I agree, I think its a phenomenal book and it was a big reason Engels and Marx struck up their friendship and got Marx more interested in economics. You're 100% right about the problems Engels writes about not disappearing but simply being shipped off to the periphery. But even within the west a lot of the problems are still there. For example, Engels has a part about how a lot of the time poor areas are glammed up on the outside if they're in view of the wealthy people or if they might affect the business of nearby shopping areas but behind the pretty veneer the same problems are left untouched. And I read that around the same time as the Grenfell Tower fire happened, where poor housing was wrapped in flammable cladding so it would look nice and not devalue nearby wealthy properties. Same things, 160 years apart.
I also agree on the first point, its hard to get a sense of perspective when he says x number of people were sent to the workhouse without knowing how many people live in that city or how it compares to other places. With your second point, I think the idea of the book was to show people in Germany what life was like in the most advanced capitalist society and therefore what lay ahead for themselves. As such I think the reader at the time would be expected to deduce for themselves the differences between life in England and Germany, although obviously that's a lot more difficult for us now lol.
I think its good to read The Ragged Trousered Philanthropists alongside Engels. Granted, its a fictional book and it was written around 60 years after TCOTWCIE but I think it gives a very good account of the problems Engels writes about but from the first person perspective of working class people themselves.
What do you think of The Condition of the Working Class in England? I think it can be very dry in some parts but its still definitely one of my favourite books, pretty sure it was one of the first left wing books I read.
It's very good. I think every socialist should read it. I think it works great as an audiobook, which isn't true for most theory books. The level of suffering is hard to imagine. It's helpful I think to read this book in tandem with Planet of Slums. Because when you bring up the book to any lib or chud, their response every time is that "sure things were bad back then but it's better - capitalism lifts all boats!" Planet of Slums clearly outlines how all that misery has just been outsourced to the global south.
I have only two very mild criticisms of Engels. And they aren't really criticisms even, just things I wish he'd included.
He always brings up data points like "there are 2,000 workers employed in nail factories in Wigan"... but he never really gives a sense of perspective regarding how large the working class is in relation to other classes. Were they the majority at that time? A large minority? Engels never says. The absolute numbers are useful and have their place but I wish he wouldn't solely rely on them.
I wish he would have done more to explain how, it is very possible if not likely that workers had a better life under earlier stages of capitalism and/or feudalism
But overall I love it and highly recommend it.
I agree, I think its a phenomenal book and it was a big reason Engels and Marx struck up their friendship and got Marx more interested in economics. You're 100% right about the problems Engels writes about not disappearing but simply being shipped off to the periphery. But even within the west a lot of the problems are still there. For example, Engels has a part about how a lot of the time poor areas are glammed up on the outside if they're in view of the wealthy people or if they might affect the business of nearby shopping areas but behind the pretty veneer the same problems are left untouched. And I read that around the same time as the Grenfell Tower fire happened, where poor housing was wrapped in flammable cladding so it would look nice and not devalue nearby wealthy properties. Same things, 160 years apart.
I also agree on the first point, its hard to get a sense of perspective when he says x number of people were sent to the workhouse without knowing how many people live in that city or how it compares to other places. With your second point, I think the idea of the book was to show people in Germany what life was like in the most advanced capitalist society and therefore what lay ahead for themselves. As such I think the reader at the time would be expected to deduce for themselves the differences between life in England and Germany, although obviously that's a lot more difficult for us now lol.
I think its good to read The Ragged Trousered Philanthropists alongside Engels. Granted, its a fictional book and it was written around 60 years after TCOTWCIE but I think it gives a very good account of the problems Engels writes about but from the first person perspective of working class people themselves.