Removed Comment by
PM_ME_YOUR_FOUCAULTS [he/him, they/them]
reason: I hope you're just trying to make an edgy joke, but even so, Soviet symbolism has no place on lemm.ee.
The above users in this thread are posting (and then re-posting) soviet symbolism (and apparently calling me a Nazi for removing said content). I am banning the second user, as they are clearly aware that they are re-posting removed content.
Not sure if I actually have to justify removing soviet and/or nazi symbolism, but I have lived my whole life in a country on the border of Russia. My country been ravaged by both Nazis and Soviets in very recent history. I want to be clear that while I think criticising capitalism is totally normal and necessary, I am also extremely aware of constant Kremlin propaganda. Propaganda which is spread both in their media, but also crucially in online channels. Propaganda which includes things like downplaying horrifying actions of the soviet union, portraying their "enemies" (the west) in the worst possible light, and mixing in soviet symbolism wherever possible. I have no intention of allowing anything which resembles this propaganda to be spread through lemm.ee. If banning offending users does not work, then further steps will definitely be taken.
To the Hexbear users who are in this thread: I'm not sure what your goals are, but I'm sure you realize that this is the meta community of another instance, not some meme community. Are you trying to make your instance look bad? I see very few good faith posts from you guys here.
Equating Nazi symbolism with Soviet ones just feels like such a weird thing to do, there's a reason Nazi symbols are banned in several (if not a majority) of European countries, but is not the case at all when it comes to soviet symbols. I think it's specially disappointing because the image that was originally shared was a reference to the "spectre" line in the communist manifesto. The hammer and sickle symbol has a long history that supersedes the history of the Soviet Union as a state, even my "third-world country" in Latin America (I'm sure you can see in the logs where I'm posting from) has a history of using the symbol for liberatory causes.
The hammer and sickle symbol has a long history that supersedes the history of the Soviet Union as a state, even my “third-world country” in Latin America (I’m sure you can see in the logs where I’m posting from) has a history of using the symbol for liberatory causes.
That's a very important point, thanks for the comment. For me, such symbolism immediately associates with people glorifying the soviet union, but I understand that there can be lots of people out there who don't associate it with Russia at all.
I have no trouble distinguishing them based on what kind of concentration camps they ran. I assure you that "the soviets occupied your country for 50 years, but it's ok because they initially fought the other guys who occupied you" is not as good of a "gotcha" as you believe.
I take your words to mean that I should be grateful that the soviets only replaced 20% of the population in my country, because the germans were planning to replace 50% (according to Generalplan Ost). To some, it may be an interesting philosophical debate whether evil can be measured in population replacement percentages, or whether we should try to measure evil like this at all. Believe me that what you're saying is nothing new to me (or to any Estonian who has ever discussed this subject with any non-Estonian). It's a debate I have heard hundreds of times throughout my life, and it's not one I wish to participate in again right now.
By the way, what you're saying is also a very common Kremlin talking point when it comes to the soviet occupation of my country - trying to direct the conversation to how horrible to Nazis would have been, so "surely the actions of the Soviets were justified in that context".
The thing is though, most people do distinguish them quite heavily. The hammer and sickle is still frequently used as an international symbol of worker's liberation while the swastika, black sun, etc are firmly attached to one of the greatest atrocities in human history. To compare them as equals, even without their direct relation in history, is extremely strange and something that only fascists would typically do in an effort to downplay the holocaust
We were thankfully able to turn things around after the (relatively recent) collapse of the soviet union. We were able to join both NATO and the EU, and while quality of life has not fully caught up to the nordics, I have been able to witness a constant improvement since my childhood.
You kinda do have to justify it because it's not normal to equate nazi and Soviet symbols. That's not something an average user would anticipate to encounter from an instance. It should definitely at least be explicitly spelled out to users when they sign up or view content from here.
Removed by mod
Must have missed that in the rules 🙄
You're only allowed to post the symbolism of good wholesome nations like the US (don't ask what happened to all the Native Americans)
We are just vibin, sir.
What is your issue ?
maybe this one will be received better
The above users in this thread are posting (and then re-posting) soviet symbolism (and apparently calling me a Nazi for removing said content). I am banning the second user, as they are clearly aware that they are re-posting removed content.
Not sure if I actually have to justify removing soviet and/or nazi symbolism, but I have lived my whole life in a country on the border of Russia. My country been ravaged by both Nazis and Soviets in very recent history. I want to be clear that while I think criticising capitalism is totally normal and necessary, I am also extremely aware of constant Kremlin propaganda. Propaganda which is spread both in their media, but also crucially in online channels. Propaganda which includes things like downplaying horrifying actions of the soviet union, portraying their "enemies" (the west) in the worst possible light, and mixing in soviet symbolism wherever possible. I have no intention of allowing anything which resembles this propaganda to be spread through lemm.ee. If banning offending users does not work, then further steps will definitely be taken.
To the Hexbear users who are in this thread: I'm not sure what your goals are, but I'm sure you realize that this is the meta community of another instance, not some meme community. Are you trying to make your instance look bad? I see very few good faith posts from you guys here.
Equating Nazi symbolism with Soviet ones just feels like such a weird thing to do, there's a reason Nazi symbols are banned in several (if not a majority) of European countries, but is not the case at all when it comes to soviet symbols. I think it's specially disappointing because the image that was originally shared was a reference to the "spectre" line in the communist manifesto. The hammer and sickle symbol has a long history that supersedes the history of the Soviet Union as a state, even my "third-world country" in Latin America (I'm sure you can see in the logs where I'm posting from) has a history of using the symbol for liberatory causes.
deleted by creator
That's a very important point, thanks for the comment. For me, such symbolism immediately associates with people glorifying the soviet union, but I understand that there can be lots of people out there who don't associate it with Russia at all.
Are you having difficulty distinguishing between the people who perpetrated the holocaust and those who liberated the concentration camps?
I have no trouble distinguishing them based on what kind of concentration camps they ran. I assure you that "the soviets occupied your country for 50 years, but it's ok because they initially fought the other guys who occupied you" is not as good of a "gotcha" as you believe.
Permanently Deleted
I take your words to mean that I should be grateful that the soviets only replaced 20% of the population in my country, because the germans were planning to replace 50% (according to Generalplan Ost). To some, it may be an interesting philosophical debate whether evil can be measured in population replacement percentages, or whether we should try to measure evil like this at all. Believe me that what you're saying is nothing new to me (or to any Estonian who has ever discussed this subject with any non-Estonian). It's a debate I have heard hundreds of times throughout my life, and it's not one I wish to participate in again right now.
By the way, what you're saying is also a very common Kremlin talking point when it comes to the soviet occupation of my country - trying to direct the conversation to how horrible to Nazis would have been, so "surely the actions of the Soviets were justified in that context".
The thing is though, most people do distinguish them quite heavily. The hammer and sickle is still frequently used as an international symbol of worker's liberation while the swastika, black sun, etc are firmly attached to one of the greatest atrocities in human history. To compare them as equals, even without their direct relation in history, is extremely strange and something that only fascists would typically do in an effort to downplay the holocaust
How's your country doing today?
We were thankfully able to turn things around after the (relatively recent) collapse of the soviet union. We were able to join both NATO and the EU, and while quality of life has not fully caught up to the nordics, I have been able to witness a constant improvement since my childhood.
What are your views on Roma
Was your childhood before or after the fall?
You're not getting good faith posts because you're equating the people who carried out the Holocaust with the people who put a stop to it
Very curious to hear your views on the Roma
Careful this sounds like Kremlin propaganda to me.
deleted by creator
Me frantically looking for my
button and realizing it's MF cool.
Complaining about bad faith communists after you ban communist symbols
You kinda do have to justify it because it's not normal to equate nazi and Soviet symbols. That's not something an average user would anticipate to encounter from an instance. It should definitely at least be explicitly spelled out to users when they sign up or view content from here.
Name your country, coward.
deleted by creator