Hello comrades. In the interest of upholding our code of conduct - specifically, rule 1 (providing a friendly, safe and welcoming environment for all) - we felt it appropriate to make a statement regarding the lionization of Luigi Mangione, the alleged United Healthcare CEO shooter, also known as "The Adjuster."

In the day or so since the alleged shooter's identity became known to the public, the whole world has had the chance to dig though his personal social media accounts and attempt to decipher his political ideology and motives. What we have learned may shock you. He is not one of us. He is a "typical" American with largely incoherent, and in many cases reactionary politics. For the most part, what is remarkable about the man himself is that he chose to take out his anger on a genuine enemy of the proletariat, instead of an elementary school.

This is a situation where the art must be separated from the artist. We do not condemn the attack, but as a role model, Luigi Mangione falls short. We do not expect perfection from revolutionary figures either, but we expect a modicum of revolutionary discipline. We expect them not simply to identify an unpopular element of society hitler-detector , but to clearly illuminate the causes of oppression and the means by which they are overcome. When we canonize revolutionary figures, we are holding them up as an example to be followed.

This is where things come back to rule 1. Mangione has a long social media history bearing a spectrum of reactionary viewpoints, and interacting positively with many powerful reactionary figures. While some commenters have referred to this as "nothing malicious," by lionizing this man we effectively deem this behavior acceptable, or at the very least, safe to ignore. This is the type of tailism which opens the door to making a space unsafe for marginalized people.

We're going to be more strict on moderating posts which do little more than lionize the shooter. There is plenty to be said about the unfolding events, the remarkably positive public reaction, how public reactions to "propaganda of the deed" may have changed since the historical epoch of its conception (and how the strategic hazards might not have), and many other aspects of the news without canonizing this man specifically. We can still dance on the graves of our enemies and celebrate their rediscovered fear and vulnerability without the vulgar revisionism needed to pretend this man is some sort of example of Marxist or Anarchist practice.

  • frauddogg [null/void, undecided]
    ·
    8 days ago

    And what did 'changing the discourse' do? We're in fucking Amerika; these crackers are on ZERO MOTION! All that was changed was the flavor of the wind they expel! What materially changed????

    • Dirt_Possum [any, undecided]
      ·
      8 days ago

      This shit just happened, what kind of material change could you possibly expect to see yet? These things are never immediate and full, correct material analysis is almost always elusive until after a fair amount of time has passed where we've been able to see how things shake out. But how about the reversal on the anesthesia coverage decision, that was certainly a material change that is going to matter to a fuckton of people who have to get surgery. Really, the extent to which even deeper material change comes about as a result of this event all depends on whether or not there are some leftists somewhere who are taking advantage of this moment to seize on the widespread radical sentiment and direct it towards real productive radical outlets. And I'm certain there are some. I've talked to some who said they were making some real headway with wavering chuds, and I would like to believe them, but I'd bet there are more in little pockets all over the place now able to push things in directions they weren't able to before this happened. Like I said, it remains to be seen.

      @xiaohongshu@hexbear.net gave me some things to think about when xioa posted them in this thread, in case you missed it:

      Instead of seeing the opportunity and the vast possibilities opened up by this incident (far more “normal” people are supportive of left wing position than the left has been crying about for years that everyone in America is too selfish/too stupid to support healthcare rights), instead they chose to focus on the individual traits of the dude (a very liberal way of looking at the whole situation) and selectively ignore that the reaction has been a collective emotional outburst of the working class people who have been yearning to see some kind of justice being done - justice that the left only fantasized about but never delivered.

      It seems clear that the only lesson to be learned from here is that if you don’t want the luigi dude to be cheered at, then the left better stand the fuck up and be the change they want to see. Again, I’m not talking about killing CEOs, I’m talking about actually organizing and push for a real change to the system.

      And if you’re too afraid to stand up and do something, don’t cry about it when someone else you don’t like foolishly and accidentally did something that resonates with the plights of the working class that he got all the praise instead. There is nothing you can do at this point to change how most people feel about this incident. It’s already too late.

      The whole complaint about the reaction to this incident has the sequence of events completely backward: the emotional release that came from the masses happened because it seems like the only “good” thing that has happened in years. In 2016, people were discussing about seriously getting single-payer healthcare. In 2020, people were talking about how the pandemic can potentially bring about universal healthcare. In 2024, nobody - absolutely nobody - was talking about the deteriorating and debilitating healthcare situation during the election cycle. The left wing movement is dead, and people will latch on to whatever that gives them a sliver of hope, however unrealistic it may seem to be.

      • frauddogg [null/void, undecided]
        ·
        8 days ago

        The left wing movement is dead, and people will latch on to whatever that gives them a sliver of hope, however unrealistic it may seem to be.

        If fascists are what gives them that "sliver of hope," then I was right to spite them. To paraphrase what I told Awoo and didn't get listened to: you may as well cosign uplifting klansmen at this point. Like, if David Duke's hypothetical protegé goes out and caps a modern-day oil baron, I'd expect you, her, and about 86 other posters here to be chinhanding this the exact same way at this point. This is exactly why I only organize with my folk; y'all feel less and less safe about who you'll up with every passing day.

        • Ivysaur [she/her]
          ·
          8 days ago

          This shit genuinely about to be the last straw for me. 600 pages of shit that should have started and ended with “cool he murked a ceo, next”

          there’s been a lot of shit the last few months that have made me raise my eyebrows but everyone now seemingly making the hill they die on (very aggressively!!!) defending this weird libertarian tech bro who shot a ceo as their working class hero ride or die is so incredibly Not It I swear to god I am losing my mind trying to remain here

          “what’s tailism lmao nerds” these are my western leftists

        • Dirt_Possum [any, undecided]
          ·
          8 days ago

          I think the sliver of hope was someone-anyone finally just blowing away a CEO like ever CEO deserves (better than they deserve honestly). And none of them look at this guy who did it and see "a fascist" they see a pretty average almost median American politically, infected with many of the same brainworms they also are, obviously none of them recognizing it as such. But they're still at the beginning of the pipeline. There's still hope, at least as I see it. Personally I was never worse than a clueless radlib and always thought communism sounded good even as I was being taught it was supposed to be evil, but there are so fucking many leftists including here who were just as bad if not worse than this Luigi. (I don't don't want to draw attention if he doesn't want it, but he did openly post about it, so I'll go ahead and ask did you see what SorosFootSoldier had to say on that topic?) I get why you only organize with your folk, I understand why that's the wisest and best decision. But there are still crackers I think we can save from sliding further down that pipeline and stick them on the one with us at the end. Doesn't mean you have to have anything to do with them, but there are some still able to pull their heads out of their ass and look around. And an event like this, in my opinion? Can help some of them along in doing that.

          edit: I wrote all the above before your edit. I don't know what to tell you frauddogg, I'm not a cracker but I'm not black. I wouldn't ever fucking sell out a comrade like you, but I wouldn't ever expect you to take mine or anyone's word for that either. Call me naive, I also haven't totally given up even on the mayos, not all of them. They even gave me a little more hope recently when they all in unison had the correct reaction to the fucking CEO getting popped. Maybe you're right and they'll forget tomorrow and nothing will come of it. But I still think it's worth it for leftists to make attempts to use this moment however they can.

          • frauddogg [null/void, undecided]
            ·
            8 days ago

            (I don't don't want to draw attention if he doesn't want it, but he did openly post about it, so I'll go ahead and ask did you see what SorosFootSoldier had to say on that topic?)

            I hadn't seen it as it happened; but I've since gone back to find it-- and I'm going to be 100% frank with you, since you've presumably been the same with me: maybe it is possible for someone to change in the span of two years; but the entire reason I don't give that benefit of the doubt is because putting that faith in the wrong one gets folk like me killed or worse. Maybe someone can hairpin in that short a timespan, but I genuinely wouldn't be able to believe it without a substantial receipt of their works in the time that they claim to have changed.

            • Dirt_Possum [any, undecided]
              ·
              8 days ago

              I agree and would suggest that you not give them the benefit of the doubt just because they fucking say they've changed. They have to show it. They have to demonstrate through their actions. Even then, I know it requires some faith to trust them, and I don't blame anyone who decides against it no matter how much they've demonstrated. If you only want to organize with your own folk, you should only organize with your own folk. But whether you trust them or not, some of them really are genuine, and if they are, they'll still do the right thing even if you don't or won't ever give them your trust.