Entrusting our speech to multiple different corporate actors is always risky. Yet given how most of the internet is currently structured, our online expression largely depends on a set of private companies ranging from our direct Internet service providers and platforms, to upstream ISPs (sometimes...
This one is a tough nut to crack, because generally I agree, but holy fucking shit we're talking about Kiwi Farms here.
There is nothing not one fucking thing that place produces that isn't a garbage fire of harassment, abuse, and violence.
Usually the EFF is spot on, but I find their argument in this case pretty weak. While I think there are better ways to handle this as well than straight censorship, like give me a break, EFF, no one is doing anything about these scumfucks. I would give one shit about such an argument if I felt there was anything that would happen to stop this, but I'm pretty fucksure it won't. If I felt like law enforcement was closing in and as was going to charge everyone involved in the site under some sort of gang-harassment law (which probably doesn't even exist), then maybe this argument would hold weight. But I don't feel like that, and I feel like the more people make weak arguments for horrendous places like this, more vulnerable people will continue to suffer Kiwi Farms abuse, harassment, and violence.
Who the fuck is actually doing that, EFF?? You're basically arguing for endless abuse from these fucks because the justice system doesn't give one fucking shit about what they're doing because the justice system doesn't generally give a fuck about vulnerable people.
I think all of your analysis about Kiwi Farms is right. Absolute fucking cesspool that doesn’t need to exist.
I don’t think Tier 1 providers should police their content because I don’t think Tier 1 providers should police any content outside of direct government intervention (which is a different can of worms). That’s the argument here. Giving Tier 1 providers room to police this content gives them precedent to police other content and suddenly Lemmy is blocked because of some random reason.
The root issue here is net neutrality and that might be the discontent. Look at it from a phone perspective instead. Do you think the operators of the phone backbone (not individual providers like Verizon or Mint) should be able to turn off phone access to a chunk of numbers because a group of individuals are misusing those numbers? Why do you think the backbone, not the direct provider, should be able to take those actions? Should the backbone even be listening to those calls? Or should some other sector be handling that abuse, like the FTC going after VoIP robospam?
If you think the phone backbone should police people making phone calls, then you can reasonably argue another utility backbone like internet can also police. Both the EFF and I fundamentally disagree with that premise. Because we do not have net neutrality, it is easy to mask that distinction that this Tier 1 provider would not be able to do this in other utilities.
Like I said, I generally agree, but I'm also not arguing for giving Tier 1 providers those "powers."
I'm saying the argument is weak because we're not in any position for any of the real, offered solutions to be done successfully in any reasonable capacity. I'm not saying them doing that is the best thing, and it does set a bad precedent, but I'm tired of acting like there's nothing we can do because we don't have the perfect options.
The cops aren't coming after these guys, and there is no political movement to create laws to address this. Which means, in the meantime, Kiwi Farms will not stop. Real people's lives are being destroyed, and I think it kind of matters to them that we can't wait for bullshit incrementalism, mostly because its their fucking lives.
That first quote is such a weak argument too. People get kicked out of places all the time for doing illegal and terrible things. Who is this "we" that goes "after the bad guys and holds them accountable"? What does that even mean?
And while we're at it, why wouldn't there be some sort of interdiction with the post office? Are "we" not telling the government about these bad guys doing illegal and/or terrible things? Are "we" Batman or something?