We have a federal presidential constitutional republic or FPCR in the US. It has three branches of government at the federal level that ideally work as checks and balances on each other. Then there are many subordinate state governments that act as a means of delegating responsibility for the federal government. Our representatives in federal, state, and local governments are democratically elected and ideally should represent the majority of the population. We the people rule in America. The US is not without its flaws, but we are a democracy.
We are circling the fascist drain. A fascist take over could happen in the 2024 election cycle next year. It's not really surprising how low confidence is in our intuitions when Republicans are actively dismantling them for power.
The Democrats have been active participants in that though. They've been in power since 2020 and they fucked around making up excuses about imaginary roadblocks (like the parliamentarian) to doing shit people actually wanted. Their inaction and abject failure has hurt a lot of people who voted for Democrats in real ways and that's why people are losing faith in governance, among many, many other things.
Democrats had a tight majority because of flaws in our democracy that allow Republicans to disproportionately represent themselves. Democrats had to negotiate around Kyrsten Sinema and Joe Manchin. It honestly impressive Democrats got anything done at all, but the legislation they did pass is not enough on its own. If we don't fix the issues with our democracy soon we are going to lose it, because Republicans are going to keep exploiting everything they can until they get total power.
I legit don't care if we lose it at this point because it seems like it's been pretty worthless all along. At least as a democracy for anyone other than slave/property owners.
I really care. Without democracy, people like me and the people I care about are going to end up in death camps. American prisons are probably where it will happen. Once Republicans ram through the death penalty everywhere.
How exactly has the democracy prevented that? The American 'democracy' has overseen many genocides in its past, I don't see this as a deviation from form. I've pretty sure I'd be on the chopping block too, but the key distinction is I'm not putting my faith in voting as a preventative measure for that
Non-violent means to prevent violence should be cherished. It's true, the US committed genocide against Native Americans. That is obviously morally wrong. We haven't been doing that in the 20th or 21st centuries though.
How exactly has the democracy prevented that?
Elected politicians are beholden to the people, so they can't go around killing all of their voters.
As robot pointed out, the killing never stopped- the US killed approximately a third of the population of North Korea, dropping more bombs on that part of the peninsula than on all of Europe in WW2.
Elected politicians are beholden to the people, so they can't go around killing all of their voters.
Conveniently, the millions of people killed and displaced by Americas warmongering don't get a fucking vote lol.
I mean the killings stopped after the cease fire that ended the fighting in the Korean War if not the war itself. Yeah, it seems like America was over inclusive on what were military targets in the Korean War.
Conveniently, the millions of people killed and displaced by Americas warmongering don’t get a fucking vote lol.
Yes, if you're not in a democracy you don't get a vote. I don't get the practicality of being completely anti-war. Wars are an inevitable part of human society. Atrocities committed in war don't undermine the value of democracy. In fact, I would argue that democratic societies experience fewer atrocities because their governments are beholden to the people and do not have absolute power.
In fact, I would argue that democratic societies experience fewer atrocities because their governments are beholden to the people and do not have absolute power.
The reality is because you're too busy inflicting them on everyone else, and to people it's socially acceptable to hate within in your society (criminals, homeless people, ethnic minorities).
Wars are an inevitable part of human society.
muh human nature, pay no attention to the material conditions behind the curtain
I don't think it is social acceptable to hate people. But as far as I'm concerned what you're saying is a non sequitur.
Lol, because the USSR and China never got involved in wars, okay. Communism doesn't prevent wars and in fact the scarcity of resources communists societies generate would probably cause wars.
You seem to fall right in line when it comes to the russophobia, Communists saved the world from fascism and you guys can't seem to forgive them for that.
And you already made it clear that your consideration for people ends at your national borders, that's a pretty hateful mentality, especially when you're using your "democratically controlled" military and economic influence to coerce weaker countries into shitty deals.
I don't care what ethnicity you are, you're repeating the same shit about how everyone saying anything other than CNN talking points is a russian or chinese bot, fuck off.
Communists and Capitalists saved the world together.
lmao okay yang gang
No, I care about what happens across national borders.
Yeah no shit, you pretty clearly want to make sure the resources keep coming from there, but for the brown people to stay where they are.
The PRC has the same three branches of government, including a President at the head of the executive branch, and a constitution that lays out their roles (more thoroughly than the US does the power of the judiciary), and it also holds direct elections for municipal offices. Neither country directly elects its President, as the PRC has elected officials vote and the US has the Electoral College say "just trust me bro" before giving the election to the other guy half the time (based on elections this century).
We can see how the electoral college votes, just as we can see that China's elections are a sham. Loyalty to Xi is the only thing that matters in Chinese politics now.
We can see how the electoral college votes, hence why I wasn't worried about asserting that it just hands the votes to the other guy half the time, because if you are going to have a popular vote anyway, there's not much cause to just tip the scales in the direction of land owners unless you were against democracy.
Have you ever made the slightest effort to investigate China's elections? Or do you just believe what the western press tells you about them? There's that saying that there is no need to burn books if you can just persuade people not to read them and we have here a demonstration why.
The electoral college is one of the flaws I would like to see fixed. We should abolish the electoral college. It disproportionally benefits Republicans because they control more land, as you said. Representative democracy is supposed to represent the majority of people not a minority.
I read a variety of what the free press has to offer about China. Xi has clearly consolidated power around him. It's not a secret.
Non-profit does not mean its not run by capitalist interest
While the Sandler Foundation provided ProPublica with significant financial support, it also has received funding from the Knight Foundation, MacArthur Foundation, Pew Charitable Trusts, Ford Foundation, the Carnegie Corporation, and the Atlantic Philanthropies.
Can't find anything about funding right now, and I'm tired. But I do know they routinely publish articles inconsistent with the values of their namesake.
But I need to go to bed. Ive been doing this all day.
I don't see why you feel the need to be so picky. Any story can be cross referenced from multiple sources. Regardless, we can always argue later. Please get sleep. =)
The US is not without its flaws, but we are a democracy.
We literally had a bunch of unelected people in robes declare the president, just over 2 decades ago.
Our representatives in federal, state, and local governments are democratically elected and ideally should represent the majority of the population.
ideally should is doing a lot of lifting in that sentence- They don't. Local governments are often dominated by landlord interests, as well as homeowners- that's often accomplished by systematically disenfranchising renters.
Again, the unelected people in robes declared that money is speech, not only swaying elections but allowing influence to be bought directly. How is that a democracy?
You seem to be conflating the concept of 'democracy' with the freedom to spend money however it may hurt someone else structurally. That's pretty authoritarian if you're someone without money.
The Supreme Court has numerous issues. For starters, they aren't elected so they aren't beholden to the people. They have minimal ethics guidelines so they can accept bribes from billionaires. They don't have term limits, so they are effectively 9 kings and queens. The electoral college allowing two presidents to win their first term without the popular vote and the Senate giving conservative states over representation has allowed conservatives to capture the court. edit: typo
These compounding issues are destroying our democracy. If we don't fix these issues we will not have democracy. The Supreme Court is already stripping rights from people, it's only a matter of time before Republicans win back the Congress and the Presidency. If the Republicans are still controlled by fascists then and we haven't fixed these problems we are going to be trouble.
ideally should is doing a lot of lifting in that sentence- They don’t. Local governments are often dominated by landlord interests, as well as homeowners- that’s often accomplished by systematically disenfranchising renters.
Yeah, rent is way too expensive. Another reason for socialism to the pile. edit: spacing
I would make the case that the supreme court has never been anything other than a reactionary institution, and it sounds like you agree.
I would go on to point out that the rights 'won' by the supreme court are ephemeral and can be snatched away at any moment-
Take some of the examples of 'liberal' rulings- Roe vs wade came about the whole question of abortion from a liberal angle of privacy. Rather than simply providing a universal standard of prenatal healthcare to people, they opted for this sideshow. It's never been about life, maternal mortality is ridiculously high in the the US, it's about maintaining the profitable status quo.
The gay marriage ruling is another example of how worthless rights won by supreme court are- and how we should expect them to be retracted at any moment.
Yeah, with the way the Supreme Court is now definitely. The concept of settled law was bullshit. It's nine votes and whoever has the most wins. McConnell understood that better than most apparently. Hopefully we will be able to fix this in time to stop a fascist take over.
We have a federal presidential constitutional republic or FPCR in the US. It has three branches of government at the federal level that ideally work as checks and balances on each other. Then there are many subordinate state governments that act as a means of delegating responsibility for the federal government. Our representatives in federal, state, and local governments are democratically elected and ideally should represent the majority of the population. We the people rule in America. The US is not without its flaws, but we are a democracy.
deleted by creator
We are circling the fascist drain. A fascist take over could happen in the 2024 election cycle next year. It's not really surprising how low confidence is in our intuitions when Republicans are actively dismantling them for power.
The Democrats have been active participants in that though. They've been in power since 2020 and they fucked around making up excuses about imaginary roadblocks (like the parliamentarian) to doing shit people actually wanted. Their inaction and abject failure has hurt a lot of people who voted for Democrats in real ways and that's why people are losing faith in governance, among many, many other things.
Democrats had a tight majority because of flaws in our democracy that allow Republicans to disproportionately represent themselves. Democrats had to negotiate around Kyrsten Sinema and Joe Manchin. It honestly impressive Democrats got anything done at all, but the legislation they did pass is not enough on its own. If we don't fix the issues with our democracy soon we are going to lose it, because Republicans are going to keep exploiting everything they can until they get total power.
I legit don't care if we lose it at this point because it seems like it's been pretty worthless all along. At least as a democracy for anyone other than slave/property owners.
I really care. Without democracy, people like me and the people I care about are going to end up in death camps. American prisons are probably where it will happen. Once Republicans ram through the death penalty everywhere.
How exactly has the democracy prevented that? The American 'democracy' has overseen many genocides in its past, I don't see this as a deviation from form. I've pretty sure I'd be on the chopping block too, but the key distinction is I'm not putting my faith in voting as a preventative measure for that
Non-violent means to prevent violence should be cherished. It's true, the US committed genocide against Native Americans. That is obviously morally wrong. We haven't been doing that in the 20th or 21st centuries though.
How exactly has the democracy prevented that? Elected politicians are beholden to the people, so they can't go around killing all of their voters.
deleted by creator
Removed by mod
As robot pointed out, the killing never stopped- the US killed approximately a third of the population of North Korea, dropping more bombs on that part of the peninsula than on all of Europe in WW2.
Conveniently, the millions of people killed and displaced by Americas warmongering don't get a fucking vote lol.
I mean the killings stopped after the cease fire that ended the fighting in the Korean War if not the war itself. Yeah, it seems like America was over inclusive on what were military targets in the Korean War.
Yes, if you're not in a democracy you don't get a vote. I don't get the practicality of being completely anti-war. Wars are an inevitable part of human society. Atrocities committed in war don't undermine the value of democracy. In fact, I would argue that democratic societies experience fewer atrocities because their governments are beholden to the people and do not have absolute power.
The reality is because you're too busy inflicting them on everyone else, and to people it's socially acceptable to hate within in your society (criminals, homeless people, ethnic minorities).
muh human nature, pay no attention to the material conditions behind the curtain
I don't think it is social acceptable to hate people. But as far as I'm concerned what you're saying is a non sequitur.
Lol, because the USSR and China never got involved in wars, okay. Communism doesn't prevent wars and in fact the scarcity of resources communists societies generate would probably cause wars.
You seem to fall right in line when it comes to the russophobia, Communists saved the world from fascism and you guys can't seem to forgive them for that.
And you already made it clear that your consideration for people ends at your national borders, that's a pretty hateful mentality, especially when you're using your "democratically controlled" military and economic influence to coerce weaker countries into shitty deals.
I'm ethnically Russian thanks. My family where Russian-Jewish fur traders from Siberia. I don't have anything against the Russian people.
Communists and Capitalists saved the world together.
No, I care about what happens across national borders.
I don't care what ethnicity you are, you're repeating the same shit about how everyone saying anything other than CNN talking points is a russian or chinese bot, fuck off.
lmao okay yang gang
Yeah no shit, you pretty clearly want to make sure the resources keep coming from there, but for the brown people to stay where they are.
I hope you're getting something out of directing your arguments at me. I know I'm getting a good laugh out of it.
The PRC has the same three branches of government, including a President at the head of the executive branch, and a constitution that lays out their roles (more thoroughly than the US does the power of the judiciary), and it also holds direct elections for municipal offices. Neither country directly elects its President, as the PRC has elected officials vote and the US has the Electoral College say "just trust me bro" before giving the election to the other guy half the time (based on elections this century).
We can see how the electoral college votes, just as we can see that China's elections are a sham. Loyalty to Xi is the only thing that matters in Chinese politics now.
We can see how the electoral college votes, hence why I wasn't worried about asserting that it just hands the votes to the other guy half the time, because if you are going to have a popular vote anyway, there's not much cause to just tip the scales in the direction of land owners unless you were against democracy.
Have you ever made the slightest effort to investigate China's elections? Or do you just believe what the western press tells you about them? There's that saying that there is no need to burn books if you can just persuade people not to read them and we have here a demonstration why.
The electoral college is one of the flaws I would like to see fixed. We should abolish the electoral college. It disproportionally benefits Republicans because they control more land, as you said. Representative democracy is supposed to represent the majority of people not a minority.
I read a variety of what the free press has to offer about China. Xi has clearly consolidated power around him. It's not a secret.
A press thats 100% controlled by the capitalist class and expresses their interests cannot reasonably be described as free.
Read a non-profit news source then.
https://www.propublica.org/
Non-profit does not mean its not run by capitalist interest
How about another one then?
https://www.motherjones.com/
Can't find anything about funding right now, and I'm tired. But I do know they routinely publish articles inconsistent with the values of their namesake.
But I need to go to bed. Ive been doing this all day.
I don't see why you feel the need to be so picky. Any story can be cross referenced from multiple sources. Regardless, we can always argue later. Please get sleep. =)
We literally had a bunch of unelected people in robes declare the president, just over 2 decades ago.
ideally should is doing a lot of lifting in that sentence- They don't. Local governments are often dominated by landlord interests, as well as homeowners- that's often accomplished by systematically disenfranchising renters.
Again, the unelected people in robes declared that money is speech, not only swaying elections but allowing influence to be bought directly. How is that a democracy?
You seem to be conflating the concept of 'democracy' with the freedom to spend money however it may hurt someone else structurally. That's pretty authoritarian if you're someone without money.
The Supreme Court has numerous issues. For starters, they aren't elected so they aren't beholden to the people. They have minimal ethics guidelines so they can accept bribes from billionaires. They don't have term limits, so they are effectively 9 kings and queens. The electoral college allowing two presidents to win their first term without the popular vote and the Senate giving conservative states over representation has allowed conservatives to capture the court. edit: typo
These compounding issues are destroying our democracy. If we don't fix these issues we will not have democracy. The Supreme Court is already stripping rights from people, it's only a matter of time before Republicans win back the Congress and the Presidency. If the Republicans are still controlled by fascists then and we haven't fixed these problems we are going to be trouble.
Yeah, rent is way too expensive. Another reason for socialism to the pile. edit: spacing
I would make the case that the supreme court has never been anything other than a reactionary institution, and it sounds like you agree.
I would go on to point out that the rights 'won' by the supreme court are ephemeral and can be snatched away at any moment-
Take some of the examples of 'liberal' rulings- Roe vs wade came about the whole question of abortion from a liberal angle of privacy. Rather than simply providing a universal standard of prenatal healthcare to people, they opted for this sideshow. It's never been about life, maternal mortality is ridiculously high in the the US, it's about maintaining the profitable status quo.
The gay marriage ruling is another example of how worthless rights won by supreme court are- and how we should expect them to be retracted at any moment.
Yeah, with the way the Supreme Court is now definitely. The concept of settled law was bullshit. It's nine votes and whoever has the most wins. McConnell understood that better than most apparently. Hopefully we will be able to fix this in time to stop a fascist take over.