"Neither Moscow nor Kiev" is not a coherent position in a conflict, and as long as you are paying your spanish taxes, is functionally equivalent to Adam Something paying to have his channel shouted out on a 155mm shell meant for donbass children.
We don't accept "neither washington nor beijing" here; so I'm having a really hard time understanding how "neither moscow nor kiev" got as much traction as it did here tbh
Lack of a party line and the occasional bout of liberal brainworms are to be expected given that this is a english language leftist shitposting site and not a serious org.
Fair point to raise, it's just a particularly irksome contradiction to me. Like, that's one of those that consistency feels like it should be really easy to manage considering those two concepts, even regarding a gaggle of shitposters.
It's not nice that I discuss your nationality and gender (well, that bit was brought up by others), but when combined with your biases they are very telling. Even the (presumably Ukranian) that you've been chatting with had to hard disagree with you on the whole "I'm neutral because both sides suck" and "90% Hitler vs 99% Hitler" comparison.
And the only reason why you can think that a nation like Russia is "90% Hitler"- is genuinely because of your privilege or bias (which is not necessarily tied to nationality and definitely not gender in the case of geopolitics, but certainly has some correlation with the former). The only reason why you can wash your hands of the issue (despite recognizing which nation is the true aggressor, and which is acting to ensure its survival) is because you have no stake in the game and have not had comparable experiences, nor learnt appropriate empathy as such (and unlike "smol bean" victims like the Palestinians who can barely resist, or the AES nations which you can easily agree with, supporting Russia is inconvenient to you).
Russia isn't an imperialist nation, and despite your misgivings, by its actions alone it is if anything an anti-imperialist nation, not just in Europe but across the world (and it has been in varying degrees so for a long time, even after the collapse of the Soviet Union- despite the fact they tried to join NATO). Today Russia is actively working to create an anti-imperialist, multipolar, genuinely democratic world order among nations with the rest of the BRICS, and it is actively assisting in the development of the global south as well as their security from western destabilization, from the MENA region to the Sahel or the Caribbean, etc... apart from social issues which are valid (but not remotely comparable in the context given and you know it) criticisms, you have nothing to pin on Russia, save for fearmongering that Russia could in time develop to be like the west (because even as a capitalist state it is not remotely akin to the west and their imperialist world order), despite the fact that Russia's actions are if anything as counterproductive as it could get to developing a worldwide imperialist system like that which the west has established, and that Russia neither has the means, nor the present desire to pursue such a path.
And even if I'm not to point at your gender, admittedly there's no way in hell I won't point out nationality (as someone living in a western country myself, but who also has family elsewhere/was born elsewhere, is not white, etc) in this regard- Russia is NOT guilty of what the white, western imperialist order is actively engaging in as we speak. It is NOT comparable. I'm bringing up your nationality in this regard because the bias is literally that obvious, and it comes from exactly that point. It sucks to hear it, but as someone from a NATO country as well- WE ARE THE BADDIES. Russia is not remotely comparable. It's not a struggle between "90% Hitler and 99% Hitler," at most it's akin to the struggle between, say, the reactionary and non-socialist governments of Poland, Yugoslavia, Greece, etc. vs. the Axis, with the difference being that this time around Russia can properly and fully fend for themselves, thankfully. It's not even the struggle between "genocidal empires Britain/France/USA vs. the Axis," it's "the empire (NATO/the collective west) vs. the rest." There is literally no comparison and I think you and the entire west needs to learn that.
I've read a response from comrade @xiaohongshu@hexbear.net, and it's making me think. I'll reconsider the 90% Hitler vs 99% Hitler, and the possibility of critical support to Russia in the context of BRICS in a multipolar world. I still won't defend people who enlist themselves to fight in the Russian army, and I definitely won't call that based, but as the mentioned comrade has pointed out, there's likely biases that western leftists commit because of their situation.
I suggest you consider treating fellow leftists with respect, though, as the aforementioned comrade did, instead of using dismissive tone, discussing their nationality and gender with other comrades openly, and calling them "eurolibs" and speculating about their position on Spanish genocides in America. Hexbear is supposed to be a leftist safe space, where we're all here to discuss and learn, and not to diss and dunk on each other.
How on Earth are you comparing the Beijing government and economic system to the Moscow one? They have nothing in common other than being geopolitical enemies of the USA.
How on Earth are you comparing the Moscow government and economic system to the USA/NATO one? They have nothing in common other than their internal economic structure.
It's the principle of the thing, not a memberwise comparison; but I get the sense that you're going to deliberately look past that point to keep arguing, so I'm disengaging from this. I genuinely don't have the patience to argue this with you when you're picking bits and pieces out of my point to cobble your own interpretation of what I said.
"You claim to be a communist yet you participate in the system you've been forced to live in. I am very smart"
Being primarily anti-nato, especially towards the general public, is compatible with criticism of the contemporary russian government.
I take it for granted you actively donate money to the Russian military for them to free the Russo-Ukrainians in Donbas, or that you're volunteering for the chance of warring in Ukraine, since support to Russia's military operation is the morally correct stance and so much as paying taxes in the west is equivalent with supporting Azov?
Again, if your whole point is that I'm a nazi for saying that dodging the draft is good (on either side btw), you're very free to put your money where your mouth is and to go to Russia and join the armed forces
"Neither Moscow nor Kiev" is not a coherent position in a conflict, and as long as you are paying your spanish taxes, is functionally equivalent to Adam Something paying to have his channel shouted out on a 155mm shell meant for donbass children.
We don't accept "neither washington nor beijing" here; so I'm having a really hard time understanding how "neither moscow nor kiev" got as much traction as it did here tbh
Lack of a party line and the occasional bout of liberal brainworms are to be expected given that this is a english language leftist shitposting site and not a serious org.
Fair point to raise, it's just a particularly irksome contradiction to me. Like, that's one of those that consistency feels like it should be really easy to manage considering those two concepts, even regarding a gaggle of shitposters.
Inside you there are two wolves.
One wants a larger community to shitpost in.
One is really fucking annoyed by he/hims badposting.
You are on hexbear.
mood. It's always the he/hims isn't it (not that I haven't run into plenty of non-masc people with the same brainworms)
Removed by mod
It's not nice that I discuss your nationality and gender (well, that bit was brought up by others), but when combined with your biases they are very telling. Even the (presumably Ukranian) that you've been chatting with had to hard disagree with you on the whole "I'm neutral because both sides suck" and "90% Hitler vs 99% Hitler" comparison.
And the only reason why you can think that a nation like Russia is "90% Hitler"- is genuinely because of your privilege or bias (which is not necessarily tied to nationality and definitely not gender in the case of geopolitics, but certainly has some correlation with the former). The only reason why you can wash your hands of the issue (despite recognizing which nation is the true aggressor, and which is acting to ensure its survival) is because you have no stake in the game and have not had comparable experiences, nor learnt appropriate empathy as such (and unlike "smol bean" victims like the Palestinians who can barely resist, or the AES nations which you can easily agree with, supporting Russia is inconvenient to you).
Russia isn't an imperialist nation, and despite your misgivings, by its actions alone it is if anything an anti-imperialist nation, not just in Europe but across the world (and it has been in varying degrees so for a long time, even after the collapse of the Soviet Union- despite the fact they tried to join NATO). Today Russia is actively working to create an anti-imperialist, multipolar, genuinely democratic world order among nations with the rest of the BRICS, and it is actively assisting in the development of the global south as well as their security from western destabilization, from the MENA region to the Sahel or the Caribbean, etc... apart from social issues which are valid (but not remotely comparable in the context given and you know it) criticisms, you have nothing to pin on Russia, save for fearmongering that Russia could in time develop to be like the west (because even as a capitalist state it is not remotely akin to the west and their imperialist world order), despite the fact that Russia's actions are if anything as counterproductive as it could get to developing a worldwide imperialist system like that which the west has established, and that Russia neither has the means, nor the present desire to pursue such a path.
And even if I'm not to point at your gender, admittedly there's no way in hell I won't point out nationality (as someone living in a western country myself, but who also has family elsewhere/was born elsewhere, is not white, etc) in this regard- Russia is NOT guilty of what the white, western imperialist order is actively engaging in as we speak. It is NOT comparable. I'm bringing up your nationality in this regard because the bias is literally that obvious, and it comes from exactly that point. It sucks to hear it, but as someone from a NATO country as well- WE ARE THE BADDIES. Russia is not remotely comparable. It's not a struggle between "90% Hitler and 99% Hitler," at most it's akin to the struggle between, say, the reactionary and non-socialist governments of Poland, Yugoslavia, Greece, etc. vs. the Axis, with the difference being that this time around Russia can properly and fully fend for themselves, thankfully. It's not even the struggle between "genocidal empires Britain/France/USA vs. the Axis," it's "the empire (NATO/the collective west) vs. the rest." There is literally no comparison and I think you and the entire west needs to learn that.
I've read a response from comrade @xiaohongshu@hexbear.net, and it's making me think. I'll reconsider the 90% Hitler vs 99% Hitler, and the possibility of critical support to Russia in the context of BRICS in a multipolar world. I still won't defend people who enlist themselves to fight in the Russian army, and I definitely won't call that based, but as the mentioned comrade has pointed out, there's likely biases that western leftists commit because of their situation.
I suggest you consider treating fellow leftists with respect, though, as the aforementioned comrade did, instead of using dismissive tone, discussing their nationality and gender with other comrades openly, and calling them "eurolibs" and speculating about their position on Spanish genocides in America. Hexbear is supposed to be a leftist safe space, where we're all here to discuss and learn, and not to diss and dunk on each other.
How on Earth are you comparing the Beijing government and economic system to the Moscow one? They have nothing in common other than being geopolitical enemies of the USA.
How on Earth are you comparing the Moscow government and economic system to the USA/NATO one? They have nothing in common other than their internal economic structure.
It's the principle of the thing, not a memberwise comparison; but I get the sense that you're going to deliberately look past that point to keep arguing, so I'm disengaging from this. I genuinely don't have the patience to argue this with you when you're picking bits and pieces out of my point to cobble your own interpretation of what I said.
I'm tryna not crash out today, dammit.
"You claim to be a communist yet you participate in the system you've been forced to live in. I am very smart"
Being primarily anti-nato, especially towards the general public, is compatible with criticism of the contemporary russian government.
I take it for granted you actively donate money to the Russian military for them to free the Russo-Ukrainians in Donbas, or that you're volunteering for the chance of warring in Ukraine, since support to Russia's military operation is the morally correct stance and so much as paying taxes in the west is equivalent with supporting Azov?
going down on federal "sponsor of terrorism" charges so one unit can get an extra magazine is indeed an efficient use of energy.
Again, if your whole point is that I'm a nazi for saying that dodging the draft is good (on either side btw), you're very free to put your money where your mouth is and to go to Russia and join the armed forces
Disengage