I think this is one of the more important things I’ve written. Not only are more scientists taking seriously the possibility that the pandemic began at a research lab, but the US itself MAY have been funding dangerous coronavirus research there. https://t.co/4s0HPVu7le— Nathan J Robinson (@NathanJRobinson) May 14, 2021
Yeah I've seen those studies, which makes sense. It was a natural virus, collected in the lab, and then accidentally leaked. Totally possibly, not really disprovable, and yeah will unfortunately just be used to fearmonger against China. I think NJR's article takes the right framing, as this is an NIH funded lab and therefore the US is just as, if not more so, complicit than China, but of course that won't be said anywhere.
It’s just as likely came from pangolins. Why would nominally leftist writer give time to nuance(tm) on this issue I don’t know, it’s same as handwringing about, oh saddam is also bad, but there should be another way blah blah
Again, I encourage you to read the article. I think he builds a very compelling case, and I'd be very interested in rebuttals that aren't just "this is an disprovable theory." If something like this is true, it challenges the entire paradigm of scientific research in a way not seen since the invention of nuclear weapons, and is worth asking questions about.
It don’t think it does (and I’ve read it before posting.) but what rebuttal is there, if it’s unprovable theory? Scientists in the lab didn’t have antibodies - pffft, why trust the chinese, WHO haven’t found evidence - one of the researchers has agenda (the other ones don’t count). How do you disprove this?
Fair enough. I guess you're right that there aren't any real "rebuttals" to this argument, because most of it is just stating facts and then saying, "ok based on the combination of all these facts it's not crazy to think [x]." I would hope there is some rebuttal to this because I'd very much like for it to be wrong and buried, but I think pretending it's not worth looking into is dangerous.
The rebuttal would be to find the person first infected in November and trusting antibodies data, but it would be inherently untrustworthy to western audience (cause chinese) and live as conspiracy for the rest of the century :shrug-outta-hecks:
Which is why the blame game should be focused on government fucking up the response
I think another rebuttal that I remember hearing a lot about is finding covid not from Wuhan before Wuhan, like the covid-19 samples they found in the waste waters of Brazil, Italy, and Spain from before the first reported case in Wuhan. Do you know if this was ever disproved? Not sure why nobody has really talked about this in the context of the renewed interests in covid's origins, because all that data would point to it not originating in Wuhan at all.
I think it’s generally not treated seriously, cause genetic trees of corona point to singular virus in the november, initial outbreak all had the same exact virus in wuhan, which started spreading and mutating already in february
Yeah I've seen those studies, which makes sense. It was a natural virus, collected in the lab, and then accidentally leaked. Totally possibly, not really disprovable, and yeah will unfortunately just be used to fearmonger against China. I think NJR's article takes the right framing, as this is an NIH funded lab and therefore the US is just as, if not more so, complicit than China, but of course that won't be said anywhere.
It’s just as likely came from pangolins. Why would nominally leftist writer give time to nuance(tm) on this issue I don’t know, it’s same as handwringing about, oh saddam is also bad, but there should be another way blah blah
Again, I encourage you to read the article. I think he builds a very compelling case, and I'd be very interested in rebuttals that aren't just "this is an disprovable theory." If something like this is true, it challenges the entire paradigm of scientific research in a way not seen since the invention of nuclear weapons, and is worth asking questions about.
It don’t think it does (and I’ve read it before posting.) but what rebuttal is there, if it’s unprovable theory? Scientists in the lab didn’t have antibodies - pffft, why trust the chinese, WHO haven’t found evidence - one of the researchers has agenda (the other ones don’t count). How do you disprove this?
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Fair enough. I guess you're right that there aren't any real "rebuttals" to this argument, because most of it is just stating facts and then saying, "ok based on the combination of all these facts it's not crazy to think [x]." I would hope there is some rebuttal to this because I'd very much like for it to be wrong and buried, but I think pretending it's not worth looking into is dangerous.
The rebuttal would be to find the person first infected in November and trusting antibodies data, but it would be inherently untrustworthy to western audience (cause chinese) and live as conspiracy for the rest of the century :shrug-outta-hecks:
Which is why the blame game should be focused on government fucking up the response
I think another rebuttal that I remember hearing a lot about is finding covid not from Wuhan before Wuhan, like the covid-19 samples they found in the waste waters of Brazil, Italy, and Spain from before the first reported case in Wuhan. Do you know if this was ever disproved? Not sure why nobody has really talked about this in the context of the renewed interests in covid's origins, because all that data would point to it not originating in Wuhan at all.
I think it’s generally not treated seriously, cause genetic trees of corona point to singular virus in the november, initial outbreak all had the same exact virus in wuhan, which started spreading and mutating already in february
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The virus fragments found in water samples are also not necessarily covid-19 or related to it, there are dozens of coronaviruses.