The breach of trust sounds like it was probably because of shame, not because of any kind of deviousness or malice. Maybe treat it like a relapse of an addiction rather than a lie, and work with them on therapy / a twelve-step program / that sort of thing?
I guess my paranoia and trust problems are yet again urging me towards weird views on relationships. The minute someone lies to me at all it feels the same, and I get mad if their shame kept them from me because it shows a weakness in our bond.
there's a line in a film "I don't have to trust her I know her" knowing someone well enough means you can trust they will consistently be the same person who's motivated and tries the same things
See I can't believe in that. There is never a point where I know someone well enough to predict and depend on their actions. Someone can earn my trust by showing they, outside of circumstances, will act in an above-board, honest way with me. In turn i am honest with them and treat them well. Once they violate that trust by lying or failing me in some way, they do not get it back easily, if ever. You can never truly know someone completely, but you can trust in someone completely.
I can forgive someone for failing, but if they just let me down in a way that shows they weren't capable of doing something and didn't tell me that. Like, if someone always flakes on me when we have plans it's over. They could have had the decency to tell me they couldn't make it or put in more effort to keep to the plan. If they miss ever once in a while no big deal, or they let me know they can't or aren't sure, but to consistently let me down with intent to correct breaks my trust. In similar way, if I ask someone for help and they just never help me even though I have helped them that's it, we're done. Not always being able to help is fine, but never being able to, or even putting in any effort or trying to fund someone who can, means they don't value me as a friend. Worth noting most of this applies to closer friends, not casual friends. I don't put a lot of trust into casual friends and don't expect it from them. I do also always put in effort to reach out to my friends and be there when they need me, check in with them and make sure I'm being a good friend to them. So once they've crossed the line they don't get that anymore. I can forgive and let go my anger, but I can't ever trust them again. That might sound harsh and lonely to you, but I have been betrayed before and I can't let it happen again. Besides, most of my friends have no issue not violating my trust.
The breach of trust sounds like it was probably because of shame, not because of any kind of deviousness or malice. Maybe treat it like a relapse of an addiction rather than a lie, and work with them on therapy / a twelve-step program / that sort of thing?
deleted by creator
:stalin-heart: Good luck, comrade.
I don't think shame us a good defense. Yes it could be worse, but there's still an inability to trust the other person now.
yeah a breach of trust is an issue in that it undermines your ability to continue to trust them not a matter of deliberate malice
that being said shame is better than malice as it means that their intent is still more trustworthy
I guess my paranoia and trust problems are yet again urging me towards weird views on relationships. The minute someone lies to me at all it feels the same, and I get mad if their shame kept them from me because it shows a weakness in our bond.
there's a line in a film "I don't have to trust her I know her" knowing someone well enough means you can trust they will consistently be the same person who's motivated and tries the same things
See I can't believe in that. There is never a point where I know someone well enough to predict and depend on their actions. Someone can earn my trust by showing they, outside of circumstances, will act in an above-board, honest way with me. In turn i am honest with them and treat them well. Once they violate that trust by lying or failing me in some way, they do not get it back easily, if ever. You can never truly know someone completely, but you can trust in someone completely.
every human is imperfect and people fail there does have to be some room for forgiveness.
I can forgive someone for failing, but if they just let me down in a way that shows they weren't capable of doing something and didn't tell me that. Like, if someone always flakes on me when we have plans it's over. They could have had the decency to tell me they couldn't make it or put in more effort to keep to the plan. If they miss ever once in a while no big deal, or they let me know they can't or aren't sure, but to consistently let me down with intent to correct breaks my trust. In similar way, if I ask someone for help and they just never help me even though I have helped them that's it, we're done. Not always being able to help is fine, but never being able to, or even putting in any effort or trying to fund someone who can, means they don't value me as a friend. Worth noting most of this applies to closer friends, not casual friends. I don't put a lot of trust into casual friends and don't expect it from them. I do also always put in effort to reach out to my friends and be there when they need me, check in with them and make sure I'm being a good friend to them. So once they've crossed the line they don't get that anymore. I can forgive and let go my anger, but I can't ever trust them again. That might sound harsh and lonely to you, but I have been betrayed before and I can't let it happen again. Besides, most of my friends have no issue not violating my trust.