"...unless I'm debating someone, then being a smug, nasty asshole is actually a legit and a very effective, useful tactic."
"Nonviolent communication goes both ways, except when i'm tone policing you because you're mad at people who want to literally fucking murder you."
"centrist" assholes do be thinking if you make your debate opponent mad you win
nevermind that genocide, exploitation, apartheid, capitalism, etc, should all make any level-headed sane person incandescent with rage
Moralists don't really have beliefs. Sometimes they stumble on one, like on a child's toy left on the carpet. The toy must be put away immediately. And the child reprimanded. Centrism isn't change -- not even incremental change. It is control. Over yourself and the world. Exercise it. Look up at the sky, at the dark shapes of Coalition airships hanging there. Ask yourself: is there something sinister in moralism? And then answer: no. God is in his heaven. Everything is normal on Earth.
My favorite redditor argument in favor of this is the black musician who befriended Klan members. “He convinced them to stop being racist with kindness and dialogue!!”
Ignoring the fact that the members are not only still racist, but are using their relationship with him as “evidence” for their non-racism, it’s so absurd and infuriating to believe that the oppressed must be required to be kind and loving and forgiving and patient with the oppressor. Why should I be patient with a Nazi as opposed to shooting him in the head? Statistically, he would do that to me first. Re-education and rehabilitation isn’t “single minority putting his life at risk to talk to some clown”
“Civility” and “kindness” in debates are only acceptable for shit like whether tax money should be spent on a stadium or a new school, or which film provides superior quality in movies, not whether or not I should be able to walk to the store without being gunned down
I use passive civil language to defend the most disgusting and vile acts humanity has ever seen and that makes me a better human than you
"Im being dismissive and arrogant for the lurkers sake, i'm not trying to convince you"
My understanding is that the real best way to convince people of stuff is a little flattery, a little bullying, show some cleavage, show some supporting evidence but only a little because it's seasoning not the meal, and always appeal to emotions, prejudices, and preconceived beliefs.
In my experience, people have to meet you halfway if you want any chance of changing their mind. Diehard believes, i.e. 90% of people actively debating this shit on niche internet forums, are generally set in their ways. People who have actually do a bit of research and are starting to show some cracks in their beliefs can be brought over but they have to take that initial step themselves, trying to force people to make that step just makes them more entrenched.
Word. I keep forgetting the precept that you're not arguing with the person you're arguing with, you're doing socratic dialogue at them for the benefit of your audience who maybe isn't an ideological poltics freak.
I would also point out, most of these debates happen is spaces where there probably aren't many neutral lurkers anyway, if lurkers at all. Everyone observing probably already has a side they strongly agree with and will always interpret whatever side they already supported as having won, or, if their side gets really owned, just say it was cuz of underhanded tactics.
When I showed my grandfather in hospice Hasan Piker on twitch he said “who is this loser, why does he want my money?” I could have said “Hasan is the voice of my generation; hes the face of the online left; Hasan is the physical embodiment of good in the world.” But I did not say those things, instead I BOPPED my grandfather in the head and told him to watch and listen and learn something from Hasan Piker. He started yelling for help so I BOPPED him again, he was bleeding from his nose now, eventually the nurse came in to ask whats wrong and my grandfather stared at me, then stared at the nurse, then back at me, and I just looked at him with the praxis blank stare I always have and he just gave up on asking for help and went back to watching Hasan Piker, I tipped the nurse 5$ and thanked them for their service as a worker and told them to spit in his yogurt then left the nursing home, knowing I created not just one, but TWO fans of Hasan Piker that day has given me the ideological fervor to keep going on serving Hasan and thus the interests of communism and workers. Sometimes I dream Hasan reads my comments on twitch; sometimes Hasan’s twitch streams are broadcasted on the Times Square billboards; sometimes I dream of Hasan descending on IOF and liberating Palestine single-handedly. All of these dreams are visions and its my job to make them true, all glory to Hasan, defeat the debate bro!
You're like a weirder version of BMF except instead of posting about bugloaf you just have terminal Hasan Derangement Syndrome.
No, no, you see, you need to be civil to me. I can be as toxic and condescending as I wish, because I, as an enlightened liberal, am correct in all things and therefore the burden of civility falls onto you. You must be civil to me at all times, using rules that I will not specify and will change arbitrarily as the discussion goes on so I always have an emergency exit from the conversation when I'm backed into a corner. I'm a wonderful person to spend time interacting with.
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