i'm going to put my thoughts on waymond here cos i dont see anyone talk about this
Waymond is just as responsible for the state of things as Evenlyn is at the start of the movie, but it never really gets explored properly both within the movie but especially outside of it. I see a lot of people praise his pacifist approach, about how he's so loving and kind but idk I've lived with a father like him, who never wants to really stand up for anything and just allows his family to fall apart. It hits a little close to home as evelyn REALLY reminds me of my mum so much, and on top of that my (bri*ish) dad split with my (singaporean) mum about a year ago - coming completely out of nowhere after she busted her ass all her life to make his life easier. He gets to play the fun, don't take it too serious role while his wife takes on all the stress, and he never stands up for anything or has to change anything cos he's 'harmless' and 'kind' and non-confrontational. I think waymond's necessary to the movie, I think it's important that Evelyn hears him and learns to love herself too, and I think that's the major message from the movie - that we all can learn from each other, and that the best we can be is a combination of all the best aspects of the people we surround ourselves with, but so often I see people put waymond as this did-no-wrong, hero of the movie when he's just an absent husband up until the movie kicks off proper. No one ever really talks about how he is an important part of why there's so much dysfunction in the family at the start of the movie, and maybe im off base but honestly I can't help but shake the feeling that he gets a lot of praise cos redditors/liberal society at large love his 'avoid the problem altogether' approach to conflict
Nah you’re totally right, it’s about family trauma from all angles, not just Evelyn
What are some examples of him avoiding problems? In terms of their family business he is taking the problems there much more seriously than Evelyn (actually trying to work with the tax auditor and reach a solution) and in terms of their marriage he's constantly trying to communicate with her while she blows him off... The divorce papers were meant to force her to confront their issues, he didn't actually even want to divorce. Tbh I could also be failing to remember some details, it's been a little while since I saw the movie.
well the biggest problem he avoids, and you can see him avoid it in the main world as well as in the alpha world, is his own family - he doesn't stand up for joy when her mother is being overbearing and driving her away and he doesn't step in over in the alpha verse where joy is driven to the ends of her wits from her mother's expectations (strong relate lmao)
on top of that, the divorce comes out of nowhere - he made the decision that they were going to separate, seems to have not even tried to work on his relationship or at least made it known he was unhappy (as evidenced by how out of the blue the divorce papers were). again, I know i'm pulling from my own life on some level, but this shit happened exactly the same way with a guy who tried to put on the exact same act without actually doing the emotional work of resolving the issues within his family. but that's just my interpretation of things
also what makes you say he 'never actually wanted the divorce'? my read was that he wanted the divorce because he saw that as the solution to the family issues and insecurities he was having, which again is very much a way of avoiding actually bringing up the issues he's seemingly let bubble under the surface. also you dont just surprise someone with divorce papers as a way of forcing an issue, but that's a separate issue here
He didn't make the decision to separate, he said to Evelyn in the movie that what he wanted was to talk about their issues, that a friend of his had gotten divorce papers which led to his relationship actually getting better because it forced them to talk. You're right that isn't the best way to start the conversation, but he's shown multiple times trying to talk with Evelyn and not being given the time of day (when he has the divorce papers in hand already and hasn't shown them to her, but we can imagine that before he got to that point the dynamic was similar). I think you raise some good points, thanks for sharing your perspective.
fair enough, but i still hold that he does fail joy and that does deserve to be explored more.
and thank you too <3
spoiler
In another life, I would have loved doing laundry and taxes with you
:cri: :kitty-cri: :kitty-cri-texas: :kitty-cri-potato: :powercry-1:
This is all I have to contribute
Really found it kinda fun that the googly eye, which is a shell of something with nothing and some more something in it, was juxtaposed with the bagel, which is a torus of something (everything) with nothing around it.
They're the inverse of each other - one is "everything" surrounded by "nothing", with "nothing" at its core, the other is "everything" containing "nothing", with a disc of "everything" bouncing around the "nothing".
Edited: for clarity
thank you for taking the time to explain it, i think i understand it more now
