The Yang Gang has only gotten weirder over time it seems

  • Dirt_Owl [comrade/them, they/them]
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    2 years ago

    To be fair I would not put it past the CIA to threaten any politician that suggests UBI, even one as lukewarm as Yang

    • JoeByeThen [he/him, they/them]
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      2 years ago

      Which is funny because UBI on its own (including the manner Yang proposed) is super pro-capitalism, it's our additional policies like rent and price controls that make it useful step towards a post-scarcity state. Before the fall of the USSR it would've been the perfect release valve, but now we're seemingly in the era of 'mask off, fuck your release valves, starve.'

      • wild_dog
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        edit-2
        2 months ago

        deleted by creator

        • JoeByeThen [he/him, they/them]
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          edit-2
          2 years ago

          Nah, it's just quantitative easing with extra steps. Another method of funneling money upward. Look how quickly they raised prices in response to the stimulus checks. Slurped those apes right up.

          • wild_dog
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            edit-2
            2 months ago

            deleted by creator

            • JoeByeThen [he/him, they/them]
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              edit-2
              2 years ago

              Sure, because now they don't need a release valve. We'll just fund the cops and ukraine instead.

      • zifnab25 [he/him, any]
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        edit-2
        2 years ago

        UBI on its own (including the manner Yang proposed) is super pro-capitalism

        It relieves pressure on the lumpen proletariat and puts positive pressure on wages, by setting a functional wage floor for the unemployed. There's definitely some knock-on benefits to the retail sector that capitalists can appreciate. But its far more in line with market socialism than the laisse-faire capitalism that libertarian-conservatives champion or the finance-capitalism that neoliberals and neoconservatives champion.

        Yang picked the idea up because it was a populist message that filled an unoccupied lane in American politics. I don't think there was any institutional support for a permanent policy outside of rhetorical posturing.

        Before the fall of the USSR it would’ve been the perfect release valve, but now we’re seemingly in the era of ‘mask off, fuck your release valves, starve.’

        The populism of American politics has always been satisfied by pitting ethnic and social groups against one another. The economic reforms that stretched from the 30s to the 60s only came about because the old racial divides were breaking down. And these reforms were deliberately slanted to favor as narrow a cohort as possible, with subsequent administrations tightening them to squeeze out more and more "undesirables" until they were all rung out.

        The '08 crash and COVID proved that even current administrators aren't above using schemes like UBI as a temporary fall-back during a new crisis. But given how much money they're pouring into police and military, I have to question the point at which we consider gunning down crowds of people a better solution to domestic unrest than cutting everyone checks for a few months.

          • zifnab25 [he/him, any]
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            edit-2
            2 years ago

            Abolishing rent control was what Yang whispered to his donor constituents. UBI was what he trumpeted to his voting constituents. But in the end, it didn't matter, because he got washed at both the national and NYC municipal levels by the Old White Guys and the Cop.

        • JoeByeThen [he/him, they/them]
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          2 years ago

          It relieves pressure on the lumpen proletariat and puts positive pressure on wages, by setting a functional wage floor for the unemployed.

          I guarantee you that a US UBI implementation would come with enough costs that any benefits to the lumpen would be temporary. Yang's implementation would've destroyed the current safety net and fucked over disabled people and retirees within years. For quite some time now, Koch grifter circles have been floating talk of UBI as a reason to kill minimum wage altogether.

          • zifnab25 [he/him, any]
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            2 years ago

            I guarantee you that a US UBI implementation would come with enough costs that any benefits to the lumpen would be temporary.

            Everything modern US administrators do will suck. But this generally precludes the idea of UBI on its face, since it might help someone of the wrong ethnicity or religion or region, and so become unacceptable to everyone else in the country.

            Yang’s implementation would’ve destroyed the current safety net

            Trump and Biden both administered a COVID-period cash payments plan to families with children and it didn't put a dent in the safety net. This isn't something we're incapable of doing or even something we're fully opposed to doing at the federal level. Its just not something we're willing to do if we think it means cutting into the size of the active labor force.

            For quite some time now, Koch grifter circles have been floating talk of UBI as a reason to kill minimum wage altogether.

            Sure. It was bait that was supposed to bring in a whole new generation of business friendly populists. But then it got flagged as "Too good for the wrong kind of people" and rapidly became DOA. So now the Kochs just fund guys like DeSantis and Abbott, because wars on migrants and trans people are more effective at winning elections than promises of free money.

            • JoeByeThen [he/him, they/them]
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              2 years ago

              Trump and Biden both administered a COVID-period cash payments plan to families with children and it didn’t put a dent in the safety net.

              You don't think Yang's plan of giving people the choice of UBI or disability would've harmed the disability program?

              • zifnab25 [he/him, any]
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                edit-2
                2 years ago

                I've seen people try to navigate the Social Security Disability Insurance system in my home state of Texas and watched the absolutely absurd reasons put forward by the courts to deny extension of those benefits to applicants. I've also seen people on Disability Benefits bulking up at the gym, because earning $40k doing nothing is way better than earning $20k doing service sector bullshit.

                I don't think its a trade-off in any real sense. Folks who take UBI would simply be the ones who couldn't get access to SSDI.

    • Evilsandwichman [none/use name]
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      2 years ago

      I'd say Andrew was too incompetent to be considered a threat by the CIA but I can easily imagine they wouldn't want a politician putting that idea out publicly.

        • 420blazeit69 [he/him]
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          2 years ago

          People sometimes point out the seeming contradiction between "the CIA is stupid and has done demonstrably stupid things" and "the CIA is able to pull off all sorts of complex spying and assassinations."

          There is no contradiction: you can be stupid and pull off that kind of stuff easily if you're the government. You get to do criminal stuff with reliable people and whatever equipment you need, and in the event you draw law enforcement attention you can just make a call.

    • ssjmarx [he/him]
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      2 years ago

      Imagining everyone but Yang, Biden and Bernie dropping out. As Super Tuesday approaches, Biden voters are moving more and more towards Yang, and the order goes out.

  • StalinistApologist [he/him]
    ·
    2 years ago

    one of my bernie bros said that they threatened bernie. he's been quite docile since then so maybe it's true