Inspired by this post: https://hexbear.net/comment/3552493

Some of us were interested in getting our positions organized in a similar manner. Maybe we can produce some similar slide of our own with enough discussion. I know the original intent of this comm was meant to be sort of a meme repository, but I figure a more serious discussion is within the spirit of the place.

It's a good opportunity to learn from each other as well.

I think my idea is that we can have some discussions and do a little bit of "debate club" here in this post. If we get on the same page, we can create some graphics or other resources to simplify the arguments and find our way to the "knife edge" of the discussion, cutting through the crap more easily.

  • familiar [he/him]
    ·
    1 year ago

    Topic: Fundamental differences from the Liberal viewpoint

    I will post more thoughts on this thread, but I kinda wanted to start with something fundamental, so we can talk about where our foundations are, rather than something that is advanced and kinda doesn't matter like debating "is China socialist?". I would say a more effective ground for discussion is "What does the existence of [country] do for socialism, and what can we learn from its history?", but I'll pick that up in another comment.

    I think of discussions with liberals need to have adequate framing, and part of doing that is distingushing your audience. Let's start with three categories:

    1. Chuds and Capitalism true believers: dunk hard along with the libs.
    2. Uneducated liberals: Need to break into "capitalism is bad", often not worth much effort online, if they aren't on that path already. Depends on the wider audience.
    3. liberals/soc-dems/anti-communist Left: At least have some idea that capitalism is bad, but they don't have an idea of how to effectively fight it.

    I generally focus on group 3. You already have great "capitalism is bad" ethos. Now it's just a matter of building on that with "what are you willing to give up to overthrow it?". When it comes to compromises to liberal values, I want to be in a position to use that point as a backstop instead of crossing over into their territory.