(I didn't, largely since I've never watched a single episode, but the psychic damage and whiplash of Wholesome Pony Show having said this line was too fuckn much for me)
EDIT: More replies than upbears now. It’s probably an official struggle session now (although most of it is that one person). One must imagine SisyFEWs happy.
I think a lot of the backlash was rooted in misogyny. "Oh no, how dare men like girl thing"
Remember that a big chunk of the historical fandom was weirdo fascist edgelords who wanted to fuck the ponies and wrote horny violent fanfics about them. One of the longest fanfics about anything (FOE:PH) is basically "Made in Abyss but it's ponies and set in a post apocalyptic wasteland."
Oh God, I remember hearing talk about how terrible this was and having a peek out of morbid curiosity. I made it maybe a quarter of the way through the first chapter before I had to dip out at the exhaustively described fever dream of what MRAs imagine a society run by feminists would look like.
Wasn't there also a Fallout crossover fanfic that completely missed the humor aspect that was always present in Fallout and was sort of edgy for edginess' sake? I never read it, but its fandom was pretty
at a glance.
That was all of the Fallout crossover fanfics
The most infamous of those is the one I mentioned, Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons, but the original Fallout Equestria was also pretty bad just much, much more tame than FOE:PH was.
You said it's related to Made in Abyss so I take it there's a lot of
factor too. ![lea-why lea-why](https://hexbear.net/pictrs/image/cfc984f8-0838-45dd-9c8f-d1646b2cf4f1.png)
It predates it, but it is similar in tone and grotesqueness. Although thinking about the full depth of the problems with Made in Abyss that I covered exhaustively in a post last night, FOE:PH isn't as bad. It's a gratuitous, edgy spectacle that handles problematic themes poorly, but it's merely making an exploitative spectacle of them while Made in Abyss is even worse. AFAIK most of the characters in Project Horizons are adults though, though I think there's some nonce stuff in there too.
I have no idea why you read it, but I assume it was something like this as a situation.
I compulsively consume problematic slop, and was even worse about it a decade ago when I was in the process of rebuilding my schema from the ground up after dismantling twenty years of calcified repression brainworms, which is around when I read part of the then-incomplete FOE:PH specifically because of its reputation. Made in Abyss has to be the only thing that's actually made me sick to watch, however. I can't emphasize enough how even the people who condemn it undersell just how vile it is; it's in a league of awful all of its own. Like I feel even my "Made in Abyss is the worst thing anyone has ever made" rant is too soft, because I couldn't stomach really dredging up the specifics.
From what I know about it, there's a blurry line between "presents and does not condone, and maybe didn't read the room and has hogs eating the slop now" to "presents and claims it does not condone and it's clear the makers are also the hogs."![yea yea](https://www.hexbear.net/pictrs/image/c8895c43-ab88-444a-a6d2-ece247ef60ff.png)
I think there's generally three fuzzy categories problematic content can fall into in mainstream works: presents [bad thing] and condemns it, clearly establishing that it's bad; presents [bad thing] and shows that it's harmful but takes no overt stance, leaving the audience to infer for themselves that it's bad; and presents [bad thing] and really revels in how the spectacle of it being awful in a crass and gratuitous way.
Made in Abyss is a fourth category altogether: presents [the worst shit you'll ever see] and revels in it, and narratively treats it as normal and ok. It transcends the whole "showing things are bad vs making a crass spectacle" spectrum by becoming a de facto endorsement of what it's showing off.
Fuck, I really need to find something to take my mind of this and hope the brain poisoning from engaging with it wears off soon.
Aggretsuko is a good time and may work like brain bleach with a bit of cathartic rage.![sicko-wholesome sicko-wholesome](https://www.hexbear.net/pictrs/image/8f17c72c-b957-4a1e-8195-16515b0e6252.png)
you mentioned watching utena, did you ever finish it? it handles a lot of the stuff that you described in made in abyss but like. it is good at condemning the way children are groomed and exploited in patriarchal societies, and never sexualizes them, and has all the characters grow and change over time
I have not gotten back to it yet, I'm still working my way through Sailor Moon and nearly through the third season.
how is that? i remember the 3rd season being my favorite, but i'm a very different person now
sailor moon might be better at washing away the made in abyss, so that might be smart
It's ok. The earlier half of the season was better, I think, because Haruka and Michiro are more interesting characters when they're being people instead of standoffish edgelords without a fraction of the conviction they claim to have, and they get worse about doing that after the season's turning point. The fact that the story's being driven along by poor communication on all sides is also more frustrating than anything and brings the story down a bit - the back and forth between Haruka's "grr I'm so edgy and brooding, no one has my strength of conviction! I would sacrifice anyone and anything to save the world!" and Usagi's "Noooo that's bad actually!" just feels kind of hollow in the context of the main characters all literally dying in the first season and Usagi in particular having sacrificed her life no less than three times already by that point (well, I think she actually only died twice and the other time she just nearly died, but still). Chibiusa is also just an extremely grating character, though Usagi's character growth in starting to actually act like her mother is sweet and the one redeeming part of her inclusion in the story.
It's also written for 5-year-olds though.
Mario and Pokemon are for children too and nobody gives a shit if you like them as an adult
Mario is the tale of a union man taking mushrooms and rescuing his side piece from a human trafficking dinosaur. Pokemon is about a kid winning a series of cockfights and taking down the mafia. For kids? Hardly.![morshupls morshupls](https://www.hexbear.net/pictrs/image/c02af2c2-f4a1-4d6e-bf78-2e0565dc10ca.gif)
Tell me how good Dragon Tales is next.
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You clearly don't actually know anything about the show and you're just going off of either your own assumptions or what other people have told you. I'd explain why you're wrong, but I've dealt with enough people like you to know you'd just double down. You don't have any good reason for believing what you believe. You just want an excuse to feel superior to other people.
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There's the misogyny! Thank you for helping prove the point of my original comment![Care-Comrade Care-Comrade](https://www.hexbear.net/pictrs/image/a4b3e07f-7bad-42d1-beb7-a026e0191c37.png)
As @LGOrcStreetSamurai@hexbear.net already put it in this thread, the response to that show in retrospect does say a lot about the people making that response.
There's plenty of room to criticize its ideology and its political messages, but "X IS FOR BABIES" dogma is just... exhausting. And feeds into so much bullying-adjacent reactionary hog shit.![disgost disgost](https://www.hexbear.net/pictrs/image/49ed25ea-2634-410b-936f-9ca8b9b767ae.png)
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You know, my trans roommate likes MLP. She used to live with her abusive family who tried to force her to detransition. Among many other ways they abused her was ridiculing her for liking MLP and forcing her to hide her interest in it, and their attitude towards her interest in the show is a lot like what I'm seeing from you right now.
I work in a public school where I had seen "mature" kids bully other kids for having MLP flair on their backpacks. Or having the wrong color backpacks. Or for seeming too sensitive. Such "mature" kids tended to go to detention a lot and made teaching a lot harder than it had to be because that "maturity" seemed to compel them to bully people.![debord-tired debord-tired](https://www.hexbear.net/pictrs/image/3bc736dc-1b61-4129-8009-a5fe1e6ecf18.png)
The shows have changed over time, but the "X IS FOR BABIES"
wriggle through, year after year.
Holy shit the person we were arguing with went into the megathread to passive-aggressively call us out![data-laughing data-laughing](https://www.hexbear.net/pictrs/image/b6671e8e-7f34-45d6-82d3-509fe8a4d683.png)
It's a good thing we have people like that around to show all the babies what a shining example of maturity looks like
I just noticed that very mature user has an anime avatar.![pathetic pathetic](https://www.hexbear.net/pictrs/image/88f638fa-b04c-4d8f-9f84-f4fbe337fda2.png)
Memes about the cointoss chance of chuddery from the anime avatar haver aside, it's pretty rich that ALL CARTOONS ARE FOR BABIES yet apparently anime cartoons are for Mature AdultPeople.![morshupls morshupls](https://www.hexbear.net/pictrs/image/c02af2c2-f4a1-4d6e-bf78-2e0565dc10ca.gif)
Maturity intensifies![frothingfash frothingfash](https://www.hexbear.net/pictrs/image/97c0eab6-88fe-4105-b2ca-63846b1258f2.png)
Your mask has fallen completely off at this point. Are you going to foam at the mouth about Owl House next?
![owl-wink owl-wink](https://www.hexbear.net/pictrs/image/be19ef05-bad5-4b56-b591-24382efec81c.png)
Actually, please list out every cartoon you've watched and also plan to watch.
you have an anime pfp
Anime doesn't count because the very mature bullying poster consumes it.
Maybe there's enough
in their own treats to earn Official Seals Of Maturity. ![pathetic pathetic](https://www.hexbear.net/pictrs/image/88f638fa-b04c-4d8f-9f84-f4fbe337fda2.png)
irony poisoning, not even once
I hate that I understand and fully agree with this comments point. I spend too much time on the internet for my own good
WATCHING CARTOONS IS AGAINST HOLY SACRED ADULTHOOD THIS REACTION TO THE VERY IDEA OF WATCHING CARTOONS IS VERY MATURE![frothingfash frothingfash](https://www.hexbear.net/pictrs/image/97c0eab6-88fe-4105-b2ca-63846b1258f2.png)
... so by your own logic, you watch Dragon Tales?![fry fry](https://www.hexbear.net/pictrs/image/747d61f3-9718-4fd9-a2d3-64b9378a2e83.png)
Oh! Oh! Is Futurama also FOR BABIES(tm) because it's a cartoon?![farnsworth farnsworth](https://www.hexbear.net/pictrs/image/68d0989d-373b-4987-b3b7-775f53884184.png)
Please stop namedropping cartoons you watch.
WATCHING CARTOONS IS AGAINST HOLY SACRED ADULTHOOD THIS REACTION TO THE VERY IDEA OF WATCHING CARTOONS IS VERY MATURE![frothingfash frothingfash](https://www.hexbear.net/pictrs/image/97c0eab6-88fe-4105-b2ca-63846b1258f2.png)
... so by your own logic, you watch Dragon Tales?![fry fry](https://www.hexbear.net/pictrs/image/747d61f3-9718-4fd9-a2d3-64b9378a2e83.png)
Oh! Oh! Is Futurama also FOR BABIES(tm) because it's a cartoon?![farnsworth farnsworth](https://www.hexbear.net/pictrs/image/68d0989d-373b-4987-b3b7-775f53884184.png)
My nieces and nephews watch owl house, it seems like a cool cartoon
It's one of those "for children, but not hostile toward adults that are also present" shows.
But apparently it's also rage bait for very mature posters here.![frothingfash frothingfash](https://www.hexbear.net/pictrs/image/97c0eab6-88fe-4105-b2ca-63846b1258f2.png)
Jeez, someone needs a reeducation in the magic of friendship and harmony...
In one line you managed to present an adolescent-like preoccupation with performative adulthood in a bullying way and added some misogyny!![congratulations congratulations](https://www.hexbear.net/pictrs/image/26e3a6ce-963e-4b86-8dbf-53995af2cfba.gif)
No, I spelt it the non-sexist way. Histerical. Treatlords, begone.
The way you're presenting your "X IS FOR BABIES" dogma could be plucked right out of a grade school cafeteria from about ten years ago.
It really does seem immature to be that mad about people enjoying something that has insufficient "mature" blood, gore, or sexual violence for your tastes.
EDIT:
Oh, you just posted this too:
THAT KID'S LUNCHBOX HAS TOO MANY STICKERS IT IS TIME TO BULLY THEM IN A VERY MATURE WAY![frothingfash frothingfash](https://www.hexbear.net/pictrs/image/97c0eab6-88fe-4105-b2ca-63846b1258f2.png)
I take it this was written by a "baby," too?
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I do work in a public school; I sort of see bullies like you on a regular basis there, often harassing kids that did nothing except have the wrong color backpack, and such "mature" people like you tend to get detention.![debord-tired debord-tired](https://www.hexbear.net/pictrs/image/3bc736dc-1b61-4129-8009-a5fe1e6ecf18.png)
This is a great comment. Keep giving the weirdo losers detention, hopefully they'll get better
Honestly, unless you're talking about MLP as it existed before or after the 2010s, I just don't see how you can conclude that so confidently. Friendship is Magic was better written than half of the shows that adults are supposed to like.
I didnt watch all seasons of it but the first 3 seasons are a pretty fun kind hearted show. Gonna finish it one of these days.
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"X IS FOR BABIES" dogma. Not even once.![debord-tired debord-tired](https://www.hexbear.net/pictrs/image/3bc736dc-1b61-4129-8009-a5fe1e6ecf18.png)
It was originally written by the same person who wrote Powerpuff Girls and a lot of the humor is similar in the sense that it appeals to both kids and older viewers.
This just in: Lauren Faust being Craig McCracken's wife was a conspiracy all along; she is actually his drag persona
I thought she was a writer for that as well though?
I had tried to edit with a clarification that she wrote for both series but that McCracken was the actual creator of Powerpuff Girls, but maybe that didn't load on your end.
Ah, ok. In that case I should clarify that while she wasn't officially the show creator, I do think a lot of the writing and jokes are similar between the two.
From what I've seen, you're absolutely right about that.