Ukraine sacks army recruitment chiefs in anti-graft shakeup
www.reuters.com
President Volodymyr Zelenskiy broadened his battle against graft on Friday, firing all the heads of Ukraine's regional army recruitment centres as the war with Russia enters a critical stage.

cross-posted from: https://lemmy.zip/post/1338851

Archived version: https://archive.ph/yDjTx
Archived version: https://web.archive.org/web/20230811193345/https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/ukraine-fire-all-regional-military-recruitment-chiefs-zelenskiy-2023-08-11/

  • Boinketh@lemm.ee
    ·
    1 year ago

    Drafts should be considered a war crime against your own people. If you can't defend your country without a draft, it doesn't deserve to be defended because there are obviously not enough people willing to fight for it. Turning your citizens into slaves and sending them into the meat grinder makes you a monster.

    • tvbusy@lemmy.dbzer0.com
      ·
      1 year ago

      Making education so expensive that the only way for some to pursue education is to die for their country is a crime. If majority of your citizen view being part of army is only for poor people, your country does not deserve to be protected because obviously not enough people willing to fight for it. Turning your citizens into slaves and sending them into the meat grinder makes you a monster.

      • Boinketh@lemm.ee
        ·
        1 year ago

        You're right, but the economy forcing people into wage slavery is a separate issue that also needs to be addressed.

        • GarbageShoot [he/him]
          ·
          1 year ago

          The problem is that it isn't a separate issue, it's the same body (Congress, with WH support) that imposes these problems and then offers "solutions" to the impacted population in exchange for acting as a jackbooted thug overseas.

    • StalinForTime [comrade/them]
      ·
      1 year ago

      I'm not sure there are no situations in which draft's are permissible. If we were in a socialist society and a fascist government invades and I were Commissar of War you bet your ass the ex-bourgeois are getting drafted.

      • spectre [he/him]
        ·
        1 year ago

        I see your point, but that's a topic that should be up for discussion among your hypothetical Party/legislature. I don't think it has a clear answer.

        • StalinForTime [comrade/them]
          ·
          1 year ago

          100% agree. Me presenting it as a choice by a single Commissar for War is more tongue-in-cheek. The answer whether or we should do it is contextual but my point is that there are clear cases which I can imagine in which drafting would be clearly justified, even if of only certain groups.

          But responding to a question of whether or not we should do something by saying it would be decided democratically is evading the actual question of what you would put forward or support as appropriate policy in such a scenario. If everyone one responded that way then nothing would be decided.

        • StalinForTime [comrade/them]
          ·
          1 year ago

          I'm really not convinced that they would normally prefer to fight fascists on the front lines than to stay in a gulag, uncomfortable as the latter might be.

    • ThomasMuentzner [he/him, comrade/them]
      ·
      1 year ago

      draft is precisly because of that necessary , its put a general price on "Imperial adventure" while proffessional army will recruit itself from the lower classes and can be spend easly (they choose soo ) , its a bad as its forces the underprivledge to die for an empire whos fruits the privledge eat , while avoiding the blood...

      • Boinketh@lemm.ee
        ·
        1 year ago

        The elites will just dodge the draft anyway. At least without a draft, a sufficiently unpopular war is more likely to be shut down by people refusing to enlist. Also, you can't advocate for slavery by arguing that it solves some other problem.

        • marx_mentat [he/him, comrade/them]
          ·
          1 year ago

          Volunteer service means wars are waged outside of public consciousness now. The Afghanistan war went on for 20 years and was essentially invisible to most people in the US. The Fed openly trying to increase unemployment is at least partially motivated by the military recruitment issues going on right now. Volunteer wars are fueled by the lives of desperate poor people.

        • YoungBelden [any]
          ·
          1 year ago

          I don't have a strong opinion on the matter (nor do I support the draft in the sense of furthering imperial interests) but one effect of a draft is that it creates a class of anti-war, trained veterans both on the battlefield and at home. Which is pretty dangerous to institutional power structures if that demographic can't be kept satiated.

          Wouldn't go as far to say the draft should be re-instituted in the US or that it's a good thing. just an interesting side effect of it sometimes

    • ElHexo
      ·
      4 months ago

      deleted by creator

      • somename [she/her]
        ·
        1 year ago

        A bit fascist to assume that the only way to contribute to society is military service.

              • brain_in_a_box [he/him]
                ·
                1 year ago

                Dude "You should have to provide service to the abstract idea that is 'the nation' in order to get your human rights" is just fascism, no matter how you try to spin it.

                • Wanderer@lemm.ee
                  ·
                  1 year ago

                  To be protected by that country yes.

                  See how long you get to have your rights when you stop paying taxes or ignore the laws of the state

                  • brain_in_a_box [he/him]
                    ·
                    1 year ago

                    This nerd thinks that countries are real, and not just a legal fiction invented basically yesterday in historical terms.

                  • UlyssesT
                    ·
                    2 months ago

                    deleted by creator

              • Kuori [she/her]
                ·
                1 year ago

                starship troopers the movie was a literal send-up of fascism and you are sitting here arguing that we should do fascism so absurd it is the realm of actual parody

                or you're advocating for the book's straight up fascism. either way, you should eat a bullet, nazi.

        • Wanderer@lemm.ee
          ·
          1 year ago

          Absolute state of the world that the view that people should defend their country is facism. I'm sure the allies didn't see themselves as fascist in WW2

            • Wanderer@lemm.ee
              ·
              1 year ago

              You don't think the allies out people in jail for not helping with the war effort?

              Right tell me how every example of "you need to do something for your country to get citizenship" is fascism? Plenty have people have argued that you need to be educated to vote or to have land to vote or whatever. They are shit systems yes but they aren't fascism.

              You're just using an over used internet buzzword. It's going to lose all meaning eventually.

          • robot_dog_with_gun [they/them]
            ·
            1 year ago

            yeah uh, nationalism is usually bad. imagine fucking dying for lines on a map. Imagine killing for them.

            • Wanderer@lemm.ee
              ·
              1 year ago

              Yea what the Russians are doing is fucked. People just trying to live their lives and they come in and start killing and controlling.

      • ShimmeringKoi [comrade/them]
        ·
        1 year ago

        If you hate people leeching off the government, just wait until you hear about every single CEO and "Captain of Industry".