cross-posted from: https://lemmygrad.ml/post/5626541

  • Doubledee [comrade/them]
    ·
    3 个月前

    It has a definition I'm not sure why that's such a difficult concept.

    Unless you think Trump is like, a fascist (which I would entertain but you said you voted for him so I sincerely hope you don't think that) he's still within the bounds of liberalism. Free markets, liberty as individuals, private property, etc.

    • SeekTheDeletion [none/use name]
      ·
      3 个月前

      I would contend that Fascism is a subtype of Liberal. You go down far enough the neoliberal path and you are suddenly fascist, there’s 0 hard dividing line

      • Doubledee [comrade/them]
        ·
        3 个月前

        I think that's fair, I think there are enough distinctions (its strong nationalism and backward- looking revanchism aren't innate to liberalism, I think there are real points of conflict where libs would usually depart from fascism, absent a threat from their left) that I would accept someone categorizing it as a form of liberalism or as a separate ideology if they support their view. I think for libs though it's best to try and be charitable if it's a distinction they recognize.

        • SeekTheDeletion [none/use name]
          ·
          3 个月前

          The original fascists invented austerity and deregulation and privatization. The Nazis and Italian fascists were the pioneers of these policies, unwinding the regulations and social policies of the social Liberals that came before them.

          They are functionally indistinguishable from the “economic Liberalism” described elsewhere in this thread and “Libertarianism”. It’s all the same thing in different degrees.

          American Liberals are extremely nationalistic, chauvinist, revanchist, warmongering and imperialistic. Your point of difference doesn’t even apply

          • Doubledee [comrade/them]
            ·
            3 个月前

            I think American liberalism is distinct from other countries' in that way, yes. My experience is that it's not normal elsewhere. I think the free market strives to transcend national prerogative as well, that's why Mises and Hayek were so keen to set up organizations like the IMF and WTO to enforce market order on nations without their interests getting in the way. Libs frequently support a "world system" over national interest in other countries.

            As I said though, I can buy an argument in either direction, since fascism is so slippery as a term and the common usage of these ideas varies pretty widely. Maybe that's too accommodating on my part. I dunno. I take your point though.

            • SeekTheDeletion [none/use name]
              ·
              3 个月前

              Homie look at all the European “liberals” clamoring over themselves to arm and fund Nazis to kill Russian orcs. They only pretend to be above that shit, when rubber meets the road they all fall in line.

              If all it takes to make a Liberal into a fascist is a scratch, they were always a fascist with a thin coat of paint.

              • Doubledee [comrade/them]
                ·
                3 个月前

                For sure, liberals will always side with fascism when threatened, they are far more compatible with it than communism. And since being scratched is inevitable they will always have a fascism problem.