With the Voice to Parliament Referendum date announced to be October 14 2023, this thread will run in the lead up to the date for general discussions/queries regarding the Voice to Parliament.
The Proposed Constitutional Amendment
Chapter IX Recognition of Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Peoples
129 Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Voice
In recognition of Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples as the First Peoples of Australia:
there shall be a body, to be called the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Voice; the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Voice may make representations to the Parliament and the Executive Government of the Commonwealth on matters relating to Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples; the Parliament shall, subject to this Constitution, have power to make laws with respect to matters relating to the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Voice, including its composition, functions, powers and procedures.
Past Discussions
Here are some previous posts in this community regarding the referendum:
- The Voice referendum official Yes/No pamphlets
- Linda Burney says there is everything to gain and nothing to lose by supporting the Voice
- Families distressed after 'highly misleading' video used by anti-Voice campaigners goes viral
- The Indigenous Voice to Parliament – separating fact from fiction | 7.30
- 10 questions about the Voice to Parliament - answered by the experts
- The yes pamphlet: campaign’s voice to parliament referendum essay – annotated and factchecked
- Fact-checking for the "No" referendum pamphlet was not compulsory
Common Misinformation
- "The Uluru Statement from the Heart is 26 Pages not 1" - not true
Government Information
- Referendum question and constitutional amendment
- voice.gov.au - General information about the Voice
Amendments to this post
If you would like to see some other articles or posts linked here please let me know and I'll try to add it as soon as possible.
- Added the proposed constitutional amendment (31/08/2023)
- Added Common Misinformation section (01/07/2023)
Discussion / Rules
Please follow the rules in the sidebar and for aussie.zone in general. Anything deemed to be misinformation or with malicious intent will be removed at moderators' discretion. This is a safe space to discuss your opinion on the voice or ask general questions.
Please continue posting news articles as separate posts but consider adding a link to this post to encourage discussion.
What if a no vote is used as 'proof' no one wants indigenous representation? I can play that game too.
"The voice" is literally just enshrining in the constitution an indigenous presence in parliament. What the ever loving fuck do your other arguments have to do with this fact. What. Show your fucking work.
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That's what happened after the 2000 republic referendum. It was said that lots of people who voted no wanted a republic, but thought the wording of the question was wrong.
It ultimately doesn't matter, because 23 years later there has never been another referendum on the topic.
If you believe a no vote for the voice is going to inspire a better worded referendum - or any sort of change on the status quo in the next couple of decades, well I'm afraid I'm going to disagree with you. A "No" vote is a vote for no change for the next generation.
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Now I'm really confused. We've essentially agreed that a "No" vote will change nothing. Common ground is good!
Even if a "yes" vote did nothing (which most of us disagree with, but let's honour your vision), it would at the very least show that most of the population wants change. You have nothing to lose in showing a little hope. Why would you vote against that?
From what I can make out, your concerns are:
On your first point: More common ground! I also don't want to stop here. But that's the whole point. We start with a voice to parliament, and hopefully go on a journey together toward healing and reconciliation. We end with a treaty that has brought us together as one people.
On your second point: that's not what the constitution is for. If you put too much detail into your body there, you are stuck with that definition. A body of 10 people might be appropriate today, but inadequate in 30 years. But as it says 10 in the constitution, we are stuck with that - forever. The idea of the article in the constitution is to describe what the body is for, and the details can be adjusted as needed.
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I'm afraid not, the voice will only be able to "make representations to" parliament, just like everyone else.
Source: the proposed amendment itself
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Ok, no.
In legal terms 'may' means the Voice may act at their discretion (differing from 'shall', which is an obligation)
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'May' is used, (in addition to other reasons) because otherwise it creates a legal obligation on the Voice, to make representations.
Then that would have to be regulated by parliamentary legislation, stating exactly when and how often the Voice legally has to make representations (once a year? Twice a year?) and when exactly.
Even your example of 'the legislature and executive "shall receive" representations from the Voice' sets up the necessity of creating parliamentary legistion to regulate, as they would be needed to define how often and in what form (Email? Formal oration to shared session of HoR and Senate? Document submitted to Cabinet? Oration to Cabinet in a specific ceremonial format? Or to Department of Prime Minister and Cabinet?) those representations are to be made, in order for parliament to "receive them"
And "shall receive" still puts the legal/constitutional obligation on the Voice to come up with and present those representations, (even if they've nothing important to say at that time, or need more time to discuss an issue) and then obey all those parliamentary regulations in order to fulfil the constitutional obligations you've just created.
The current wording allows that a formal constitutional body, calling itself the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Voice, may make representations to Parliament and the Executive, and therefore that those representations will be formally recognised as coming from a constitutionally enshrined and recognised Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander entity. The current wording doesn't force them to make representations, and more importantly, doesn't mean the creation and the Voice having to follow strict rules about when, how, and how often those representations are made.
With the current wording, if the Voice decided they wanted to present their representation as a handwritten piece of paper hand-delivered to the Prime Minister, they could. Because any legislation that blocks the Voice from making a representation to the Executive would be found unconstitutional. And any legislation moderating and regulating how the Voice can make those representations could be potentially challenged in the High Court if they negatively impinge the Voice's ability to make those representations.
Basically, the current constitutional wording allows for the creation of an ATSI Voice that can't be told to shut up.
And also importantly, can't be closed down and discontinued through a legislative act of parliament.
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....... legalese on a countries constitution and your fee fees on 'weasel words' have zero relation to one another. Please stop.
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....yeah nah
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