You play as a multiethnic resistance group that performs guerrilla warfare against an overwhelmingly powerful oppressor. Feels like a leftist dogwhistle, even if realistically its normal #resistance
You play as a multiethnic resistance group that performs guerrilla warfare against an overwhelmingly powerful oppressor. Feels like a leftist dogwhistle, even if realistically its normal #resistance
Fuck yeah XCOM BABY. I love turn based strategy games lately bc the gameplay loop is just satisfying and addictive af. Xcom 2 was super slick. Finished it early this year, then went back to the OG xcom and started playing Long War which was fucking unreal. If you're a vet I'd highly recommend it if you haven't but it would be really off-putting if I was new to the series. I haven't played long war 2 and can't comment on it but I've heard mixed reviews.
Anyone fuck with other games in the genre or related genres? I loved divinity original sin 2's combat, it's like xcom mixed with DND. Has anyone played wasteland 3? I've heard it's like a crpg with xcom's combat and that sounds very nice to me.
Also if you're looking for other stuff in a similar vein...
Hard West plays like a country death ballad themed board game on the strategy layer, but then has XCOM style western shootouts. It oozes atmosphere and has a really interesting twist one the targeting mechanic where instead of hit chances characters (you and enemies) have a set amount of luck, which depletes whenever you're shot at or if you use it up on things like trick shot ricochets, and you only get hit when you run out of luck. It makes for longer exchanges of gunfire but really captures that western vibe and fits thematically with the cowboy meets the devil vibe. Also you can shoot people's hats off, so that's ace.
I also enjoyed Phantom Doctrine. It's a cold war spy game that let's you play as the USSR and has a genuinely convoluted (mostly in a good way with interesting detail, sometimes in an odd way thanks to procedural elements) espionage plot. The tactics layer (actual missions) play a lot like XCOM if it was a really, really bad idea to get into shooting matches. You're basically always outnumbered, usually outgunned, then there's alarms, reinforcements etc. It's predominantly a stealth game of neck snapping and timed sneaking, but it has a few cool mechanics that do make those short bursts of gunfire very cool.
The first is a breach mechanic (that XCOM then kinda stole for Chimera Squad) where you position your team outside of a room, usually at different entrances, and then plot their simultaneous movement into said room and where they direct their shots. All kicking in the doors and bursting into a smoke filled boardroom at once, downing four CIA ghouls with four equally well placed shots simultaneously, one from each of your agents is incredibly satisfying.
It's also stricter about sightlines and not showing you the whole map when your characters can't see it, so you can also bring agents along as support like spotters where they'll be in a building to the North, East, South, or West with binoculars and can reveal who's inside a room that you can't see for example but has a window facing them. Likewise you eventually get snipers you can use like or with the breach mechanic. It's a great moment when you enter a room only to realise you're outnumbered but then your invisible sniper picks off the last guy from the window behind him before he takes his turn. Those movie moments are gold and the soundtrack (by the same guy who did the Witcher 3) is better than almost any actual spy movie I can think of.
It has some very cool other mechanics too, like the ability to brainwash captured enemies and then send them back only for them to show up in future missions where you can turn them to your side with a control phrase, but also the rare possibility that one of your own can turn on you mid-mission. You think losing your favourite soldier in XCOM is wonderfully bittersweet, try your favourite agent suddenly turning on your team just as you're about to complete an object and then executing your second favourite agent before trying to escape!
The downside is that it's ambition and lack of budget shows more than the others mentioned here. It can be a bit unbalanced, has moments of brilliance and frustration rather than being a really solid gameplay loop every time, and I know some people who just hated the strategy layer task of scanning documents you find for procedurally generated code words to gather intel and progress the plot (although with some headquarters upgrades you can largely automate that). Also, I really liked the board game style world map where you need to station spies around the world to limit travel time for objectives, but I had a friend who got very frustrated feeling like they never had the right person for the right job in the right place. As you can tell by how long I've been typing it's definitely a mixed bag, but really interesting and like nothing else at it's best.
Finally there's Empire Of Sin which has just come out and is a classic gangster themed game with XCOM style brawls and shootouts, but a really involved and detail criminal empire management and diplomacy management. It's had mixed reviews and I haven't played it yet as it's just come out, but it's on my list.
Bro thanks for the thoughtful and thorough response, I'm going to absolutely have to check out phantom doctrine. Hard west sounds interesting too, the luck mechanic sounds goofy and unique. I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on Darkest Dungeon.
You're very welcome. As a mostly solitary and cheap gamer I don't often have much to say about the stuff most people play, but you've stumbled into one of my favourite niches here. Plus if people might spend money, especially when things are tough right now, on something I recommend I want to make sure they'll actually be interested and no what they're getting.
Truthfully I haven't played Darkest Dungeon. I probably should, but I have a bit of mental block when it comes to fantasy stuff. It's just not my aesthetic really. People absolutely rate it though and say it's wonderfully harsh sometimes.
Darkest dungeon was a game I avoided forever because it came out back when fuckin' everything was a rogue-like procedurally generated dungeon crawler permadeath shitshow. On paper, the only thing about it that I liked was the aesthetic but I heard a podcast talking about their experience with it. Copped it on sale for like 8 bucks and holy shit it was worth it lmao.
I'd say the gameplay loop resembles xcom where you enter the combat layer, level your chars and gain loot to manage your base. The biggest difference id say is that personell mgmt is more important but also more rewarding. Low level characters are a lot more expendable than in xcom, but high level characters have a bigger impact. Base mgmt is mostly choosing from new recruits, managing the sanity and diseases of your troupe, upgrading their equipment and special abilities, and upgrading buildings with various resources. I would say it takes up about the same amount of time as base mgmt in xcom but it doesn't feel as rewarding as xcom because there aren't big upgrades that give you a major advantage (e.g. first round of armor upgrades in OG xcom). Upgrades are more just plain necessary to take on harder dungeon levels and I found that out the hard way.
The dungeon crawling is the meat of the game, and I was surprised at how fun and fucking stressful it can be. Levels are randomly generated across a few different themes, and each of the dungeons have different enemies with weaknesses that can shape the team you choose to tackle each. The layouts of the dungeons are all on the same sort of grid system but have enough variety that they each feel distinct. Dungeons have hazards that can harm your party, damage their sanity, inflict disease, or even induce personality quirks. Loot and supplies share the same inventory space, incentivizing riskier provisioning that could invite bad things happening to your characters to take home better stuff. In fact, I think this game manages risk-reward better than most strategy and rogue-like games. The challenge does occasionally come from RNG (it is a turn-based game after all) but most of it is baked in and you're constantly making decisions before starting and while going through the dungeon that feel impactful.
Do I take fewer torches to open extra loot slots later? I know this level has less corridors and i might not need as many. Do I go straight to the boss or risk an injured party while scooping some extra loot? Do I snuff my torch to maximize drops but risk getting ambushed? Do I take an extra combat round to heal and risk drawing reinforcements? Instead of incentivizing the minimization of risk, it pushes you toward taking them; the boons are immediate and the punishments, disastrous.
Combat is simpler than xcom to an extent, but the characters have so much variety and situational synergy, the enemies are unique, and each encounter offers slightly different flavors of challenge. The bosses are spectacular and terrifying. It's especially challenging early on where you don't have the resources to respec characters or upgrade them, and the learning curve is hatefully steep. That said, you fuck with xcom so the threat of permadeath is nothing new lmao. I found the combat really stressful, every encounter feels like it can break bad and the game saves all the time. There's no restarting an encounter, no save scumming, you're beholden to your choices. Combat moves fast enough, and there are mods to speed it up further on PC. I had a lot of fun building little teams, experimenting with synergies, creating flexible free agents to round out other crews. Combat can see harm to your characters health and also to their sanity. Health is usually scarce but easily restored; sanity caps a bit higher but is expensive to restore at the base. Managing these two resources are integral to the combat and it's something you learn to do as you go.
The only major criticisms I have are the progression and presentation. The progression feels more incremental than dynamic, because characters will only go into dungeons at a few specific level intervals. Since you're only using low-level characters in low-level dungeons, the dungeons take the same amount of time and the characters level up at the same rate. Conversely, the higher level dungeons are gnarly and wiping means you have four characters that have to be replaced. It's challenging in a way that's incongruous with the other challenges in the game, in a way that's frustrating and tedious.
This game is also super ugly, mostly as a design decision. However, I think the UI and some of the character animations are a bit lacking. The gross, dingy aesthetic can be oppressive at times but I think it complements the theming pretty well. Your mileage may vary tbh.
Well, that was longer than I meant it to be, sorry about that.
You're a fucking champ for writing this in we much detail as you have done. Imma be real with you, you've made it more likely I'll actually play it rather than sticking it on the list forever as thwr s some elements that sound fucking great, but also less likely for it to be my next game I launch into a while I have an immediate (and easier) backlist. You've absolutely interested me in a way that I will play it rather than feeling like I should play it.
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Hard West is another in the genre, with a fantasy western theme, with demons. It's more story-focused so the missions aren't random and the characters are less expendable. The game uses a luck stat that makes you harder to hit and depletes whenever you dodge a shot or use an ability but recovers when you get hit - the trick is to find good cover when you're low on luck so you just get nicked.
I also enjoyed the Shadowrun games. In Dragonfall there's a mission where you get to shoot up a bunch of fascists :no-fash:
I've finished Wasteland 3 twice.
It's good, with some actual good humour and decent satire, and while the plot is pretty rote it has some interesting digressions and interesting world building.
The combat is tactical and not too clunky, but it's definitely less snappy and satisfying than XCOM. There's less of it though obviously with it being an RPG and stealth and speech checks often being an option. You do pretty much have to have at least one stealth attack character and always ambush enemy groups though, especially on higher difficulties, which when you get decent means most battles tend to play out the same (surprise attack on biggest threat -> thin the herd -> overwatch to protect any squad mates in 1 turn danger -> finish stragglers on next turn). There's some fun wackier weapons that have odd buffs and debuffs though for if it's a bit easy/familiar like shrink grenades, confetti and more.
There's a couple of other issues too. The stat aspect of the character progression is unbalanced to the point of being nearly useless, and since positioning and action points are so important you'll dump nearly all your stats into maxing coordination first and then speed, regardless of a character's class or build. There's a few frustrating modern Fallout-esque choices too, where the text or short description of what you'll say / who's side you'll take doesn't really match up with what you'd think and undermines your intention, but it's not too common. It's also very all sides bad although at least it has both more fun and actual grey area with that than most games of its ilk. Finally it's still pretty janky and a bit unpolished in places. Fixes have done a lot for the terrible crashing and load times it had at launch, but I still wouldn't recommend an Ironman playthrough unless you don't mind repeating a fair bit of progress.
Overall though I thoroughly enjoyed it, found it engaging all the way through, genuinely funny quite frequently (which is a rarity for me), and went back for a second helping after the first. Also, it's robots are the best.
Yeah I've heard a lot of the same stuff about wasteland, particular regarding the jank but a lot of people have been praising the story elements and narrative structure. Sounds like a worthwhile investment for sure