I called someone out on the groupchat for saying that if communist orgs can hand out leaflets with Lenin on them he should be able to do nazi salutes in public. He claimed Lenin killed millions and said “ever heard of the holodomor genocide”. I talked about how the famines weren’t a genocide (and how he'd actually been dead for almost a decade before they happened) and later said radlib came in, claimed Lenin oppressed all the people of the USSR (but admitted he helped Ukraine), posted this video and left
"lol that's US propaganda. Did he give Iraq WMDs to?"
Then link him the book "women had better sex under socialism " and just tell him it is a skill issue
How to alienate yourself and get told to touch grass by your friends - an example
Seriously, that shit only works in public semi-anonymous internet forums. Talking like an internet troll to people you know on your group chat is called being too online.
Only people who are too damn online themselves will attempt to have this conversation with you
That's debatable when anticommunism is the status quo in the US.
It is, but in the same unfocused way if all us politics. They are more likely to think of M. Bison than Stalin if you ask them.
My point is polemics only work to convince an audience, not the person you're debating. That's why they are so effective in public forums like the internet. Engaging in polemics against someone you know personally makes them not like you or your opinions. And any of your friends or acquiantences observing will feel the a same way.
Not polemics, literally just a zinger. They are only ever going to remember two or three things about it. Replace one of the facts from middle school with you laughing at them and you have improved their heuristics by 30%
I'm struggling to understand how you could think that's how minds work and the only conclusions is you genuinely believe that was an actual zinger.
They work mostly by heuristic and narrative. In this way we are addressing the extant mental prototype and addressing people in the manner relevant to their ideas on the subject.
"If I bring up holodomor to a tankie, they'll change the subject with their own sexual pathology."
That's what's going to be in their head.
but what if i'm trying to alienate myself?
Well carry on then.
the sex under socialism thing is not even remotely relavent to discussion of whether or not there was ethnic persecution under the USSR
i dont know why you think arguing about the holodomor is going to be any more productive than just linking them a nonsequitir.
Lenin time traveled after dying to do the Holdomor
Its true i was there
Yes, but that doesn't matter. Bullying your fellow nerd into the correct positions is correct. They don't belive the US propaganda because they did the math and it checks out. They belive it because it was the emotionally easiest thing to do.
When has that ever worked?
Like, a third of us here. Failing that we don't wast to much energy on people that don't deserve it.
genuinely seems like you are not just saying bullying works but that it is the only thing capable of working. The evidence for which is "well if they weren't persuaded by bullying clearly they can't be persuaded"
Both of which are baseless. I think you just prefer bullying
I an saying you have to meet people where they are at. Reasoned debate works on only a small part of people. For the most part you simply cannot do enough work on Twitter or at a coffee shop to change them. So, your options all revolve around wasting your time or planting seeds. The post hog drunk is the equilibrium point of all those forces. If you find something else to work let me know. I am down
Yeah I find planting seeds works. I also find that you can plant seeds better if you ask them questions about their position to try and draw out why they believe what they believe.
Context matters here but if you're talking to a lib reasoned debate has an actual chance to get through but just telling them off gets them to shut down. They have after all been inocculated by media mocking angry leftists for decades. I actually have found great success with the more reasoned approach with the libs in my life.
I think dunking on people just gets them defensive and they double down on their positions
I wouldn't be a communist if my friend hadn't beaten me over the head with communist propaganda and told me i was a brainwashed nerd
That's the point. These dipshits don't deserve a serious answer.
that just means they won't take your argument seriously
They never really were going to
Also, that was mostly a 100 years ago and has no relevance to important stuff today. We don't need to defend the honor of the ussr in specific cases. Just in general that it was no worse but often better than the us.
The sex thing is from east Germany for one. Also of all the arguments to use it just seems like the kind of thing a 12 year old would bring up
This is some random on Twitter. They are likely 12 yes.
We were talking about someone's message from a friend in a groupchat. Some random on twitter yeah sure whatever nothing you say will matter
but the people in your actual life there are other methods that actually work
Fair critique. It does vary more depending on the person. I would simply expect that on average people would be unreceptive unless you got a specific vibe
Well bullying works only if there is consistent social pressure from society at large that backs you up.
Something like the holodomor there is no point trying it. Because our positions are niche we have to work to spread them by planting seeds
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