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Libs: "THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NO QUESTION THAT THERE'S GENOCIDE IN XINJIANG, AND IF YOU DARE TO BRING UP THE LACK OF EVIDENCE OF ANY SORT OF ABUSE FOR THE PAST 3 YEARS YOU'LL GET BANNED!!!!"

Also libs: "Didn't you know that 15k of the 40k humans murdered in Gaza were actually terrorists? it-is-known Also, lots of civilians die in wars like the one happening in Gaza, it's sad but inevitable"

smuglord

Fuuuuuuuuuck this shit.

  • Diuretic_Materialism [he/him]
    ·
    2 months ago

    It's less about being "right" and more about which side is conducting a settler colonial genocide

    • EABOD25@lemm.ee
      ·
      2 months ago

      Israel. However hamas abducted 251 people and 97 are still unaccounted for. Two wrongs don't make a right

      • RomCom1989 [he/him, any]
        ·
        edit-2
        2 months ago

        Someone shoots you in the chest and kills your entire immediate family

        Show

        You try to punch them in response

        "Two wrongs don't make a right!"

        Add in a pinch of us-foreign-policy and a dash of hitler-detector and voilá,you have the average liberal!

      • Tomorrow_Farewell [any, they/them]
        ·
        edit-2
        2 months ago

        However hamas abducted 251 people and 97 are still unaccounted for

        It's notable that you think that the victims of a genocide should have no bargaining chips to negotiate with.

        EDIT: Also,

        Two wrongs don't make a right

        You are very willing to excuse stuff like the Ukrainian military attacking civilian targets and using civilian facilities to stage military activities. For some reason, it's only non-white people whom you apply these standards to.

        • EABOD25@lemm.ee
          ·
          2 months ago

          No I'm not. Just haven't talked about it yet. You got the numbers because I'm having trouble finding any

          • Tomorrow_Farewell [any, they/them]
            ·
            2 months ago

            No I'm not

            If taking hostages is enough for you to condemn a people to a genocide, then what the Ukrainian military does should be enough for you to support their loss, especially considering that the stakes are much lower.

              • Tomorrow_Farewell [any, they/them]
                ·
                2 months ago

                Okay, if you don't support that, and you apply the same standards to the Ukrainian military, surely you support the defeat of the Ukrainian state, as well as a complete dismantlement of NATO and its states, right?

              • GalaxyBrain [they/them]
                ·
                2 months ago

                The only mistaken assumption anyone has made here is that you have a coherent worldview or set of politics. We really shouldn't be assuming that.

      • Diuretic_Materialism [he/him]
        ·
        2 months ago

        I have a give and take relationship with people on the internet.

        This is toddler logic. You have to use violent tactics to resist genocide, it inherently involves committing "wrongs".

        • EABOD25@lemm.ee
          ·
          2 months ago

          You're right. It's such easy logic that a toddler can understand it. What's your problem?

          • Diuretic_Materialism [he/him]
            ·
            2 months ago

            My problem is the real world is more complicated than a children's book. Toddler logic doesn't work in it.

      • Cowbee [he/him, they/them]
        ·
        2 months ago

        What actions do you recommend victims of genocide take to overthrow their century-long oppressors?

              • Cowbee [he/him, they/them]
                ·
                2 months ago

                You did, though. You took an anti-Hamas stance, condemning them for October 7th, without providing any analysis of what they should have done otherwise in your opinion.

                You could have just as easily said "I am uninformed on the subject and refrain from speaking on it until I am," and that would have been better.

                  • Cowbee [he/him, they/them]
                    ·
                    2 months ago

                    I did. You said Israel was committing genocide, but "2 wrongs don't make a right." The conclusion is, therefore, that a hundred hostages against a genocidal oppressor is equivalent to a century of settler-colonial genocide.

                    This is nonsense, unless you believe Muslims to be worth less than Israelis.

                      • Cowbee [he/him, they/them]
                        ·
                        2 months ago

                        Saying "neither is right" draws equivalence. Saying "I don't know enough to draw conclusions" does not.

                        • EABOD25@lemm.ee
                          ·
                          2 months ago

                          Not really. I observe actions and observe response. Hamas acted by abducting 251 people from different parts of the world due to Palestinian oppression in Gaza, and it's been like that ever since WWII where the allies supported a Jewish state in the Israel region and then pretended like giving uprooted people Gaza was enough even though zionists want and currently are taking all the land to the Med under the claim "It's our holy land. We had it first"

                          • Cowbee [he/him, they/them]
                            ·
                            2 months ago

                            So then take a firm stance supporting Palestinian liberation and dissolution of the Zionist entity. Refuse to say "two wrongs don't make a right" and recognize that oppressed peoples have the right to use violence against their oppressors, especially when all other paths are exhausted and in the face of active genocide.

          • m532 [she/her]
            ·
            2 months ago

            The palestinians have the answer. They're doing it right now.

      • m532 [she/her]
        ·
        2 months ago

        "Roll over and die"

        oppa gandhi style

          • GarbageShoot [he/him]
            ·
            2 months ago

            When all resistance is bad but you appeal to the idea that there's some undiscovered type of resistance that is acceptable, what you are telling the victims here to do is roll over and die until some Great Man discovers that undiscovered type of resistance that liberals don't condemn.

            Fighting Israel tooth and nail is the only answer, and the handful of mostly-military captives Hamas took (and Israel fucking slaughtered!) does not mean that there is any moral equivalency ("two wrongs") or that Hamas and its coalition are not the best means Palestinians have to fight Israel.

          • m532 [she/her]
            ·
            2 months ago

            Context: Gandhi suggested for the people being murdered by the nazis to not fight back

      • GarbageShoot [he/him]
        ·
        2 months ago

        More Palestinians were dead by October 8th, and the number since then has increased by two to three orders of magnitude.

        The people abducted were mostly military, and some elderly hostages were released very quickly on account of their age. Hamas takes pretty good care of the, it must be stressed, captives taken in a military conflict, while Israel has mostly been fine with slaughtering them in indiscriminate bombing in classic Hannibal Directive fashion.

        This is all ignoring that, outside of children (whose parents are to be blamed), there really aren't civilians on the border with Gaza, as the "civilians" are still part of the enactment of Israel's lebensraum.

      • SexMachineStalin [comrade/them]
        ·
        edit-2
        2 months ago

        Two wrongs don't make a right

        Have you considered a much more urgent and pressing matter is that ISISrael has a city-state the size of municipal Johannesburg under siege; has destroyed every mosque, university, hospital, school, UN office, several diplomatic offices, the civil registry, water treatment plant, all farmland, media office, the Court of Justice, cemeteries, most high-rise buildings, effectively banned food and water, etc. At least 50,000 (likely even in the several hundred thousands) have been massacred, with priority targets being UN workers, humanitarian aid, civil rescue/defense, paramedics, professors, doctors and journalists. Several hostages have also been killed. Deaths of Hamas fighters in contrast, have been largely incidental. All of this also recorded live on the free iPhone 15 Pro Max the Nazi soldiers are given.

        Hamas was also ready to negotiate the total release of all hostages in exchange for a permanent end to hostilities literally as early as 9 October.

        Take a wild guess as to why South Africa for instance, no longer has an active underground resistance.

        7 October had maybe, a marginal effect on the already violent Nazi sentiments of ISISrael and it's supporters.