During the late 1950s and 1960s, it is estimated that the Soviet Union had some of the highest abortion rates in the world. The abortion rate during this period is not known for sure, because the Soviet Union did not start releasing abortion statistics until perestroika. The best estimates, which are based on surveys of medical professionals during this time, say that about 6 to 7 million abortions were performed per year.
One of the few insights we have regarding abortion during the late 1950s is a survey, conducted between 1958 and 1959, of 26,000 women seeking abortions, 20,000 from urban areas and 6,000 from rural areas. Several facts can be gathered from this survey regarding what kind of women sought abortions and their reasons for doing so. First of all, an "overwhelming majority" of the women were married, though the survey results do not give an exact percentage. Second, we can learn how many children the women had. Of the urban women, 10.2% were childless, 41.2% had one child, 32.1% had two children, and 16.5% had three or more children, making the median number of children 1.47. Of the rural women, 6.2% were childless, 26.9% had one child, 30% had two children, and 36.9% had three or more children, the median number of children being 2.06. Of women seeking abortions, urban women were more likely to have fewer or no children. This may have been an effect of the lack of space faced by urban women.
The survey also examined women's reasons for seeking abortions. It divided the reasons into four categories. The first was "unconditionally removable", things that could be remedied by government action, such as material need, lack of space, no one at home, or no institution to put the child in. The second category was "conditionally removable", things that might possibly be remedied by government action, such as the absence of a husband, family troubles, or illness of one or both parents. The third category was "unremovable", things that were not caused by social conditions, such as a baby in the family or many children already. The fourth category was "unclear causes", such as one or both parents unwilling to have a child and multiple other reasons.
The results for this question were: of the reasons given by urban women, 35% were unconditionally removable, 16.5%, were conditionally removable, 10% were unremovable, and 37.9% were unclear. Of the reasons given by rural women, 26.3% were unconditionally removable, 18% were conditionally removable, 10% were unremovable, and 45.2% were unclear. The most marked different was that more urban women cited lack of space as a reason. The survey results found that abortion rates were much higher among women who work, unsurprisingly, with a rate of 105.5 abortions per thousand pregnancies, as against 41.5 per thousand in women who did not work.
If the abortion rates of this survey are taken to be representative, then during this period the number of annual abortions was higher than the number of live births. This would also mean that the abortion rates in the Soviet Union were the highest of any in the world at that time. By the end of the Brezhnev era in 1982, Soviet birthrates hovered just at or below replacement level except in the Muslim-majority Central Asian republics.
Also fun :parenti: moment: listen to the NYT pearl clutching about the Soviet Union superior women's healthcare system
https://www.nytimes.com/1989/02/28/world/women-fault-soviet-system-for-abortion.html
The Soviet Union has ''the world's cruelest abortion system,'' charged a commentator in New Times magazine. ''The main thing is to queue up in time and not shudder when you climb onto the obstetrical execution block.''
Still, there is no national debate here about the morality of abortion.
''We are basically an atheist society,'' said Svetlana I. Markovich, an obstetrician-gynecologist at the Family and Marriage Clinic in Moscow. ''Of course it would be better to prevent pregnancy rather than to have an abortion. But I can't think of abortion as murder, because at the stage when abortions are permitted, this is not a person."
This is amazing.
What a fucking rag. Can't believe people have so much respect for this fucking tabloid.
huh, makes me wonder how much of the American demonization of abortion is an artifact of the cold war
The New York Times was pro-life at one point?
What the hell happened to them?
Literally where chuds gets their 100 billion death figure
Just to add context for those who may not know what you're referring to... a sizeable percentage of "The Black Book of Communism"'s 100 million number was derived by looking at population numbers and growth rates, and assuming a genocide must've taken place because birth rates must be higher. So not one shred of evidence of genocide, just saying one happened because the population didn't grow as fast as the authors thought it should have.
We now know that when material conditions improve and women have access to abortion, population rates don't stay high. But of course the Black Book was never revised for this. Funny how that works...
“Boy, these conservatives are really something, aren't they? They're all in favor of the unborn. They will do anything for the unborn. But once you're born, you're on your own. Pro-life conservatives are obsessed with the fetus from conception to nine months. After that, they don't want to know about you. They don't want to hear from you. No nothing. No neonatal care, no day care, no head start, no school lunch, no food stamps, no welfare, no nothing. If you're preborn, you're fine; if you're preschool, you're fucked.”
One of my favorite Carlin quotes.
I feel guilty that I'm glad George Carlin is dead before he could turn into a reactionary shithead.
There's an old clip of him essentially "woke scolding" Andrew Dice Clay, and going at him for (again essentially) punching down instead of punching up. He always had good instincts for who were worthwhile targets of scorn and derision. But as you say elsewhere, dementia can make you awful.
I think Carlin above all else was a nihilist who had a low tolerance for bullshit. I don't think he would have been a true comrade, no matter how right he was in pointing out the flaws of the USA, but I couldn't see him ever voting republican.
I mean...dementia could turn him into a piece of shit and it wouldn't really be his fault. There's a fine line between a nihilist with a low tolerance for bullshit and someone who thinks that speaking about minority issues and inclusion is also bullshit and turns right back into a racist shithead. A lot of his bits were about the use of language and how modern language use obfuscates the truth -- my favorite bit being going from shell shock to Post-traumatic stress disorder.
True, he'd probably take issue with people being more progressive and inclusive I'd imagine.
There's a chance also that an aging Carlin would've gone at the whiny baby comedians who thought campuses were too woke. He attacked Andrew Clay for always punching down. You ne wrong know.
He attacked Andrew Clay for always punching down.
Nice, that's good on him.
The USSR was an amazing achievement of human civilisation but it was also a society with many problems. It was good and right that the bodily autonomy of Soviet women was respected. Abortions should be readily available without judgement. But when a sizable amount of abortions happen because of things like lack of living space or lack of daycare it is a sign that housing and childcare needs serious improvement.
Women in the capitalist world were and are faced with the same issues in many places but are forced to have children they don't have the adequate material resources for. That reduces the number of abortions but it only makes the underlying issues worse.
yes exactly. The Soviet government was aware of their limited resources and part of getting the information on "Unconditionally Removable" abortions was to know how much population growth they were missing due to material scarcity. This survey was done in 1959, and in the 1960s the Soviets would begin a major national housing construction program that would build the famous "Khrushchyovkas" that still house people to this day.
The government wanted birth raths to be higher and a crueler society like the United States would have just restricted abortions and force women to have children they otherwise would not. The Soviets actually banned abortions in the 30s (the cruel times) after the GOAT Lenin legalized it in 1917. Then they did it due to low birthrates but it was mostly unenforceable then. They thankfully reversed that policy after Stalin.
TBF a big reason they had so many abortions is because people used them as birth control instead of the Pill (the USSR never made birth control for humans). BC pills have their own health issues, but it's certainly less invasive than having a procedure (especially given that they didn't have the same tech back then).
the Soviet doctor in that NYT article I linked actually talked a bit about that! she said the 1st gen pills they imported had awful side effects so they got a bad reputation but they try to recommend the newer pills. Still impressive they did all those abortions for free even if we have better methods now.
https://www.nytimes.com/1989/02/28/world/women-fault-soviet-system-for-abortion.html
This is the NYT criticizing it because "socialism bad" but they do interview a Soviet doctor
When carried out with the assistance of a trained health-care provider in sanitary conditions, abortions are one of the safest medical procedures available. But when abortions are restricted or criminalized, people are forced to seek unsafe ways to end pregnancies.
Somebody get the Black Book of Communism people on the phone
They already added the number of abortions to the USSR's "death count", but i'm sure if somebody'd call them about this, they'd just add them a second time.
Might be a good idea to just cut 1989 out of that graph, given you don't have data for the US.
Oh shit I was there! I know I've been lying about my age this whole time, but I actually worked at one of these clinics. I saw some extremely fucked up shit there which is why I'm so anti-abortion now. This is just SOME of the horrible stuff I personally witnessed:
• A 23 year old woman came in 11 months into her pregnancy and said "I don't want my stupid baby anymore, kill it" and the doctor said "okay" and he put jumper cables up her baby hole and connected them to a car battery and let it run for six days straight
• A little 8-year old girl wandered in and said "I want an abortion but I am not pregnant" and the doctor said "we'll fix that" and he stole a baby and cut the girl open and put the baby inside her and sewed her shut and then woke the girl up and said "congratulations it's a healthy six year old boy" and the girl said "can I keep him" and the doctor said no and then backed over her in the parking lot with his brand new Ford Raptor
• They made me sign an agreement promising to stop drinking from the medical waste container (I signed somebody else's name)
• One of the doctors there developed a futuristic ray gun that could make anything he shot have an abortion, even trees, cars, or barns
• The receptionist threw nail polish at an elderly man
• The doctor's assistant invented this thing she called "the silly slide" and it was a really fun little water slide that connected a woman's vagina to a paper shredder so a newborn baby could briefly "enjoy the high life"
• The oldest child we aborted was in his late 70s, we didn't even know he was a baby until his wife brought in photos
• The doctors put all sorts of crap up a woman's uterus including a clown nose, bicycle handlebars, a calendar, and an entire Sears retail outlet (before bankruptcy)
• During every successful abortion, the doctor would shout "take that, baby" and he'd push a red button that made sirens go off and confetti fell from the ceiling and we'd all get Del Taco for free
I have more stories but I'm watching a movie with James Spader and it requires all my attention because he may be Jack the Ripper
things that might possibly be remedied by government action, such as the absence of a husband
wut
Absence of a husband is not why you line up for a safe and legal abortion.
