Defend China. How is it currently socialist?

Some things to respond to (the gatcha questions):

The rapid expansion of capital, foreign and local, and the reemergence of capital accumulation as a production goal in the end of the 20th century

The existence of megacorporations, especially private megacorporations such as tencent and foxconn

the state of labor rights in the aforementioned megacorporations, and the state of labor rights in the industrial sector as a whole

The repression of marxist and leftist protest and critique of the current state of the system

The apparent lack of repression of non-leftist critique (I could easily be convinced that this is just because they're amplified by American media)

The great firewall (I could be convinced this is protectionism to avoid Western silicon valley capitalism's supremacy on the internet)

The social credit system

idk i guess talk about the Uyghurs if you want, but I don't really want that to become the entire discussion, as it has a tendency to be, so if you talk about that, don't make it the entirety of your defense or attack

and let's try to keep this relatively civil? Like, a random post and argument between some leftists on the internet isn't actually going to like, collapse china's rising economic and political power into nothing. We can't actually do shit about china, good or not, so try not to make this a flame war?

  • ComradeRat [he/him, they/them]
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    4 years ago

    Disclaimer: I did not compile this list of sources/arguments. This was compiled by low_poly_space_shiba, who has since left this server.

    the BBC made a documentary on the "concentration camps" that makes them seem like neat schools

    https://medium.com/@sunfeiyang/e284934a7aab

    UN guy visited

    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-rights-un/china-says-reached-broad-consensus-with-u-n-after-xinjiang-visit-idUSKCN1TH00T

    pakistan guy visited

    https://www.thenews.com.pk/latest/422970-pakistani-diplomat-narrates-visit-to-chinas-xinjiang

    world bank investigated

    https://www.worldbank.org/en/news/statement/2019/11/11/world-bank-statement-on-review-of-project-in-xinjiang-china

    China invited EU and they said no

    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-xinjiang-exclusive-idUSKCN1R10QQ

    just like they said no to check in Venezuela

    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-venezuela-politics-un-idUSKCN1GO2J0

    American and British imperial pigs explain every aspect of the modern anti-China approach, both goals and methods:

    Churchill, 1902: What? (https://winstonchurchill.org/publications/finest-hour/finest-hour-159/wsc-a-midnight-interview-1902/)

    Kennan, 1948: Why? (https://history.state.gov/historicaldocuments/frus1948v01p2/d4)

    Brzezinski, 1998: How? (https://dgibbs.faculty.arizona.edu/brzezinski_interview)

    https://imgur.com/gallery/iclU9H4<-relevant quotes

    in tweet form

    https://twitter.com/RodericDay/status/1285603816172380160

    One of the main voices claiming atrocities are happening in Xinjiang is Rushan Abbas.

    https://medium.com/@RobertArlan/a-reddit-ama-claiming-to-be-a-uiyghur-quickly-exposes-a-cia-asset-slandering-china-1d667c098b77

    She did a Reddit AMA and people found out she's a complete State Department asset. She literally worked at Guantanamo Bay as a translator

    https://imgur.com/gallery/Xo7cYyq<-relevant stuff

    Then there's the other guy, Adrian Zenz:

    Adrian Zenz is the expert on Xinjiang Genocide.

    He

    1. works for Victims of Communism, the organization that added worldwide COVID tallies

    2. he is a Rapturist, he thinks he was sent from God to fight the anti-christ embodied in China

    3. he has already been caught lying

    https://mobile.twitter.com/rgoodlaw/status/1259300068227760128

    basically keep an eye out for the name "Adrian Zenz" he's behind almost EVERY SINGLE uighur genocide story in the NYT/WaPo/Guardian

    there's also a massive "grassroots" campaign on social media

    https://twitter.com/j_bigboote/status/1182726991675625472?s=08

    this guy basically went and collected samples you can peruse them yourself

    another thing worth looking at is just "atrocity propaganda", that is, how the USA just says horrendous things about their enemies, smearing them with impunity and destroying their public standing before moving into sanctions, then invasion

    the classic case is Nayirah Testimony

    https://imgur.com/gallery/jYTvY1T<-relevant stuff

    (wiki Nayirah Testimony)

    other examples

    https://imgur.com/gallery/BHb8LOV<-relevant stuff

    here's an interview with a CIA agent talking about how the whole goal is to bribe and cajole journalists into creating an image that communists eat babies

    I don't know how to post video, but if you tell me how I can

    "We didn't know of one single atrocity committed by the Cubans. It was pure raw false propaganda to create an illusion of communists eating babies for breakfast."

    For a more in depth view, check out this doc (also not compiled by me)

    https://docs.google.com/document/d/1d0lynghlCnR6Hs57pypEEhlhHczFVgaYX-TIZD61s_w/edit#

    From Here On, my research

    Not about China specifically, but this article from the Guardian(sorry for the lib source) talks about DPRK defectors lying about DPRK

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/oct/13/why-do-north-korean-defector-testimonies-so-often-fall-apart

    "Cash payments in return for interviews with North Korean refugees have been standard practice in the field for years....This practice also drives the demand for “saleable stories”: the more exclusive, shocking or emotional, the higher the fee."

    "But many refugees say they feel pressured for defector stories. Ahn Myung-chol, a former prison guard at Camp 22, said people liked shocking stories and these so-called “defector- activists” were merely responding to this desire. Chong Kwang-il, a former prisoner at Camp 15, said the fame brought by media exposure trapped them, forcing them to reproduce a certain narrative."

    I'm not saying we should dismiss people's stories out of hand, but there is a large issue with people creating more shocking stories. due to both the profit incentive, and also for propaganda value