Isn't this several layers of miscommunication because some apparatus of the Chinese media has tried to curtail kpop style idol culture? And it ended up being a little mismanaged or misguided, but then western media got a hold of it and deliberated misrepresented the situation to Chinese media banned any sort of feminine guys?
Do I have that right? I just wanna know, please don't yell at me.
There was some misrepresentation, but there's also clearly an element of reactionary policy. The CPC has a pretty big faction with, let's say "boomer mentality", and this does seem to affect their media policies especially.
If you want decent analysis of it, I recommend Sixth Tone, which is actually a party publication but is very critical on many issues.
Here's a short article that argues there are reactionary motivations to the "sissy" thing. The whole website is good, and worth digging through. They have a tag for "gender" specifically, but there's a lot of interesting but critical coverage of a lot of things in there.
Dope, thanks. It looks like the “sissy” aspect has also been tied in with the skin bleaching trend they were trying to counter because of how linked the two are. Unfortunate.
there’s also clearly an element of reactionary policy
Private sector setting insane beauty standards that can only be achieved through extensive cosmetic procedures and then dictating success in mainstream media by how tightly you comply
Public policy regulation established to reverse this trend, because your committee recognizes it as socially toxic and alienating. But you're employing a gendered term to describe it
Both of these things are reactionary. Both sides. Both!!!!
Yes, they're both reactionary to a degree. The policy could and should be adjusted to avoid causing harm to people whose gender expression doesn't fit into a clear binary.
Additionally, this isn't the first time media censors in China have clamped down harder on LGBT-related media than other media. There is a current in the party with reactionary ideas with respect to gender, and it's important to recognize that.
The policy could and should be adjusted to avoid causing harm to people whose gender expression doesn’t fit into a clear binary.
It is. The habit of forcing media personalities to undergo surgery and "look white" in order to climb the media ladder is harming people who fail to fit that model.
Additionally, this isn’t the first time media censors in China have clamped down harder on LGBT-related media than other media.
When femininity is deliberately coded as white and western by Hong Kong based media syndicates and advertisers, the effort to decouple and de-capitalize an industry that's built on injecting crass consumerism into every facet of local life.
China’s multimedia censorship programs do have and have had problems surrounding LGBT issues
Other banned content includes prolonged or provocative kissing scenes and the defamation of national heroes.
This is definitely prudish, but a far cry from reactionary. It appears as though the effort is focused primarily on preserving the character of post-revolutionary Chinese society and defending against foreign efforts to interject subversive attitudes into public media. Indeed...
Yet censorship is a persistent problem. In 2015, Fan sued SAPPRFT over whether the administration had issued a notice instructing web platforms to ban his documentary, “Mama Rainbow,” from online streaming. The court ruled that SAPPRFT had not sent such a directive.
Statements like this suggest the reactionary attitudes are likely a consequence of privately run online services censoring content due to the views of the administrators. A chud run movie theater in the States might refuse to screen Brokeback Mountain or Clear Channel might pull Dixie Chicks off the airwaves because she spoke ill of the President. That isn't indicative of a state party problem, but a systemic cultural bias that needs to be confronted by the next generation of media users and producers.
Founded on August 19, 2011, it now has more than 600 members, including online media giants and video platforms such as Tencent, Sohu, and Youku, as well as the websites of state-owned media outlets like news agency Xinhua and Party newspaper People’s Daily.
So the online party publications also abide by rules preventing screening on LGBT relationships. I'm not sure why you're referring to the other banned content, that obviously has nothing to do with this.
There is, of course, a systemic cultural bias, which is why the party also has a reactionary current within it with respect to this. They're not getting the members out of nowhere.
Two things can be true at once - the party is trying to limit foreign influence with their censorship. It is also, unfortunately, limiting the expression of LGBT issues. The CPC isn't perfect, of course, and this is one of the things they do have problems with. Their own publication frequently criticizes them for it.
The rights of LGBT people have been improving in China, and it's likely to continue that way, but it's important to acknowledge where there are shortcomings.
Yeah, it was a layer of misrepresentation. It’s part of a push by the chinese government to curtail racist western beauty standards like skin bleaching and “double eyelid” cosmetic surgery to look more white. That shit has caught on huge in American-occupied South Korea (wonder why) and is attached to a lot of Kpop.
If I remember correctly, the policy was focused on requiring wider representation of gender expression in male actors besides the KPop style guys. Many actors were starting to feel pressured into skin bleaching and getting cosmetic surgery on their eyes to get work in the industry and also appeal to their fans, the majority of whom are straight women.
The party brief discussing this used a slang word in quotations as an example which doesn’t translate correctly when you throw it into google translate. I think it translated to “sissy”, which apparently wasn’t a very accurate translation. Still, that word choice also rightfully got shit in China because it is a word used by reactionary conservative boomers. This added to the confusion once the story made it over here.
This was from when the first wave of “China is banning le fembois” talking points showed up. I checked out after I saw that there was this degree of ambiguity to it because:
I don’t live in China
I don’t speak Mandarin
Our entire media apparatus is actively trying to find every angle it can to build support for a cold/hot war with China.
This then got complicated even further online because a chunk of stupidpol motherfuckers started concern trolling / stanning for China in support of them banning “sissy boys”. That then poisoned the well if you pushed back on the articles claiming this stuff.
I’m sure there’s other shit and maybe more info has come out since then. China legitimately does still have a lot of issues it needs to work on with LGBTQIA rights. This struck me as noise that got in the way of being able to actually discuss those problems.
Isn't this several layers of miscommunication because some apparatus of the Chinese media has tried to curtail kpop style idol culture? And it ended up being a little mismanaged or misguided, but then western media got a hold of it and deliberated misrepresented the situation to Chinese media banned any sort of feminine guys?
Do I have that right? I just wanna know, please don't yell at me.
There was some misrepresentation, but there's also clearly an element of reactionary policy. The CPC has a pretty big faction with, let's say "boomer mentality", and this does seem to affect their media policies especially.
If you want decent analysis of it, I recommend Sixth Tone, which is actually a party publication but is very critical on many issues.
thank you!
If you’ve got a link to any sixth tone articles about this, that would be helpful. I’d like to read up on where things are at now.
https://www.sixthtone.com/news/1008389/chinas-ongoing-struggle-against-sissy-young-men
Here's a short article that argues there are reactionary motivations to the "sissy" thing. The whole website is good, and worth digging through. They have a tag for "gender" specifically, but there's a lot of interesting but critical coverage of a lot of things in there.
Dope, thanks. It looks like the “sissy” aspect has also been tied in with the skin bleaching trend they were trying to counter because of how linked the two are. Unfortunate.
Private sector setting insane beauty standards that can only be achieved through extensive cosmetic procedures and then dictating success in mainstream media by how tightly you comply
Public policy regulation established to reverse this trend, because your committee recognizes it as socially toxic and alienating. But you're employing a gendered term to describe it
Both of these things are reactionary. Both sides. Both!!!!
Yes, they're both reactionary to a degree. The policy could and should be adjusted to avoid causing harm to people whose gender expression doesn't fit into a clear binary.
Additionally, this isn't the first time media censors in China have clamped down harder on LGBT-related media than other media. There is a current in the party with reactionary ideas with respect to gender, and it's important to recognize that.
With respect to online multimedia, see below.
China's multimedia censorship programs do have and have had problems surrounding LGBT issues, which is unfortunate and hopefully will change.
It is. The habit of forcing media personalities to undergo surgery and "look white" in order to climb the media ladder is harming people who fail to fit that model.
When femininity is deliberately coded as white and western by Hong Kong based media syndicates and advertisers, the effort to decouple and de-capitalize an industry that's built on injecting crass consumerism into every facet of local life.
This is definitely prudish, but a far cry from reactionary. It appears as though the effort is focused primarily on preserving the character of post-revolutionary Chinese society and defending against foreign efforts to interject subversive attitudes into public media. Indeed...
Statements like this suggest the reactionary attitudes are likely a consequence of privately run online services censoring content due to the views of the administrators. A chud run movie theater in the States might refuse to screen Brokeback Mountain or Clear Channel might pull Dixie Chicks off the airwaves because she spoke ill of the President. That isn't indicative of a state party problem, but a systemic cultural bias that needs to be confronted by the next generation of media users and producers.
So the online party publications also abide by rules preventing screening on LGBT relationships. I'm not sure why you're referring to the other banned content, that obviously has nothing to do with this.
Movies with LGBT themes (such as Brokeback Mountain) actually often don't get widespread theater screenings in China. This has also been touched on in Sixth Tone.
There is, of course, a systemic cultural bias, which is why the party also has a reactionary current within it with respect to this. They're not getting the members out of nowhere.
Two things can be true at once - the party is trying to limit foreign influence with their censorship. It is also, unfortunately, limiting the expression of LGBT issues. The CPC isn't perfect, of course, and this is one of the things they do have problems with. Their own publication frequently criticizes them for it.
The rights of LGBT people have been improving in China, and it's likely to continue that way, but it's important to acknowledge where there are shortcomings.
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Yeah, it was a layer of misrepresentation. It’s part of a push by the chinese government to curtail racist western beauty standards like skin bleaching and “double eyelid” cosmetic surgery to look more white. That shit has caught on huge in American-occupied South Korea (wonder why) and is attached to a lot of Kpop.
If I remember correctly, the policy was focused on requiring wider representation of gender expression in male actors besides the KPop style guys. Many actors were starting to feel pressured into skin bleaching and getting cosmetic surgery on their eyes to get work in the industry and also appeal to their fans, the majority of whom are straight women.
The party brief discussing this used a slang word in quotations as an example which doesn’t translate correctly when you throw it into google translate. I think it translated to “sissy”, which apparently wasn’t a very accurate translation. Still, that word choice also rightfully got shit in China because it is a word used by reactionary conservative boomers. This added to the confusion once the story made it over here.
This was from when the first wave of “China is banning le fembois” talking points showed up. I checked out after I saw that there was this degree of ambiguity to it because:
This then got complicated even further online because a chunk of stupidpol motherfuckers started concern trolling / stanning for China in support of them banning “sissy boys”. That then poisoned the well if you pushed back on the articles claiming this stuff.
I’m sure there’s other shit and maybe more info has come out since then. China legitimately does still have a lot of issues it needs to work on with LGBTQIA rights. This struck me as noise that got in the way of being able to actually discuss those problems.
I'm gonna be honest with you, I have no idea who is correct in this argument. Just admired the high quality discourse it sparked lol.
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