Ironically the Mexican State surrounding them on all sides is the only thing preventing them being crushed, else they would be long gone, and they reject being associated with anarchism or communism, publicly denouncing vanguard parties or their support.
It will eventually collapse, they fail to provide even the most basic of infrastructure for themselves.
I think people who downvote things they disagree with are nerds haha just so you know that I didn't downvote you. I know they identify as explicitly Neozapatismo in philosophy, but various Zapatistas have talked about their influences and they borrow from all branches of marxism. They're, basically, explicitly non-sectarian haha but I think it's hard to argue they don't lean pretty firmly towards anarchism
I also think it's hard to argue they will inevitably collapse because they don't provide for themselves. They've been running for decades and decades, and seemingly only gaining ground. But I'm admittedly not that familiar with the movement.
They've been 'running' entirely at a State's mercy that has no interest in reeducating them or killing them. If they were instead surrounded by Anglos or other colonizers they would be long gone.
The smug eurocentrism here is palpable. This paternalist instinct to dismiss indigenous movements for not adhering to a brand of leftism and thus doomed to failure is really gross tbh.
Its a material fact. Mexico doesnt want to kill or erase indigenous movements and lets them do their thing, an Euro state or Anglos would have put them in a reservation or worse
And it was the indigenous movements under Zapatista in the first place that forced constitutional guarantees into the Mexican government for their benefit. But because indigenous movements in Mexico don't conform to whatever eurocentric vision of self liberation and determination whether it be anarchist or ML, they must be doomed to failure because they're dumb indians. Incredibly tiring.
No lol they are doomed to failure because their ideology lies mostly on the anarchist side and thats how historically it often goes. Maybe they will be the exception, but I doubt it. Also the worsening of global heating will require far more organization than they have and areas under their control have been having clashes with medical personnel and desinfection crews. Let me know when they have infrastructure to make vaccines or hospitals that can do surgeries, things necessary in the modern age.
Maybe the indigenous people in the Zapatista movement know better what they need to do to ensure their survival as a people and culture than your eurocentric ass.
Just using coffee as an example, Mexico produces over a quarter million metric tons of coffee, vs like what 150-200 tonnes. Their model just doesnt compare or scale.
Ironically the Mexican State surrounding them on all sides is the only thing preventing them being crushed, else they would be long gone, and they reject being associated with anarchism or communism, publicly denouncing vanguard parties or their support.
It will eventually collapse, they fail to provide even the most basic of infrastructure for themselves.
I think people who downvote things they disagree with are nerds haha just so you know that I didn't downvote you. I know they identify as explicitly Neozapatismo in philosophy, but various Zapatistas have talked about their influences and they borrow from all branches of marxism. They're, basically, explicitly non-sectarian haha but I think it's hard to argue they don't lean pretty firmly towards anarchism
I also think it's hard to argue they will inevitably collapse because they don't provide for themselves. They've been running for decades and decades, and seemingly only gaining ground. But I'm admittedly not that familiar with the movement.
downvoting your own comments is the real praxis
I don't know how to best support you, comrade, so I will neither up nor downvote, but I will comment to tell you I have not done so.
They've been 'running' entirely at a State's mercy that has no interest in reeducating them or killing them. If they were instead surrounded by Anglos or other colonizers they would be long gone.
EZLN is basically a commune within a capitalist state. You can join a commune in the US too, that doesn't make it socialist
The smug eurocentrism here is palpable. This paternalist instinct to dismiss indigenous movements for not adhering to a brand of leftism and thus doomed to failure is really gross tbh.
Its a material fact. Mexico doesnt want to kill or erase indigenous movements and lets them do their thing, an Euro state or Anglos would have put them in a reservation or worse
And it was the indigenous movements under Zapatista in the first place that forced constitutional guarantees into the Mexican government for their benefit. But because indigenous movements in Mexico don't conform to whatever eurocentric vision of self liberation and determination whether it be anarchist or ML, they must be doomed to failure because they're dumb indians. Incredibly tiring.
No lol they are doomed to failure because their ideology lies mostly on the anarchist side and thats how historically it often goes. Maybe they will be the exception, but I doubt it. Also the worsening of global heating will require far more organization than they have and areas under their control have been having clashes with medical personnel and desinfection crews. Let me know when they have infrastructure to make vaccines or hospitals that can do surgeries, things necessary in the modern age.
Maybe the indigenous people in the Zapatista movement know better what they need to do to ensure their survival as a people and culture than your eurocentric ass.
Sure
You are both talking what ifs so why don't you both watch and learn. Arguing over if something might happen that you have no control over is useless.
If an anarchist leaning project fails it's always a matter of ideology if an ML leaning project fails it's always a matter of circumstances.
What are the collective farms, coffee plantations, schools, and armies then?
Just using coffee as an example, Mexico produces over a quarter million metric tons of coffee, vs like what 150-200 tonnes. Their model just doesnt compare or scale.