E: I reread the first part of this and sorry if I sound a bit too blunt. I don't mean too and think people should be allowed to enjoy things. :(
So I usually don't really buy into the "gamer keyboard" thing but it's mostly because of the hype around marketing. The bigger name keyboards are kind of garbage and I don't think someone is gonna be a better gamer just because they can press a key a nanosecond faster.
But with that said, spring weight is absolutely a thing. linears like reds seem to be marketed towards gamers because they are around 35g spring weight so they are easier to press, but spring weight only really matters with regard to typing fatigue. So for me, as an example, I can type on 45g springs all day long but I tried out 55g Gateron Blacks for a while and hated them. My hands just felt tired and would get crampy after any amount of typing. I think this experience translates to gaming too. If you are doing a longer gaming session, spring weight is pretty important since I think the last thing you wanna get frustrated over when losing all day in Apex(that me) is your keyboard fighting you.
The video on their site when they cover activation point, that's just actuation and it's normal on mechanical switches. I've seen some discussion on Lekker switches but not a lot so can't speak fully on them but outside of like sound dampening and the D dumb style tactiles, there really hasn't been that much new innovation in the MX style switches. Cursious about the tiny magnet they mentioned though.
My current rec for anyone that is just wanting to get a mech is to go with Keychron but I will keep an eye on Wooting.
With all that said, my focus is on split, columnar stagger instead of row stagger. Our fingers naturally move up and down better than laterally and column stagger addresses this and row stagger doesn't. This is part of what causes repetitive injury in people that type a lot(carpal tunnel and ulnar deviation) Ulnar deviation is how your wrists are unnaturally bent outward while typing. My split boards allow me to adjust each half into an arch that matches the natural position of my hands, and I get to space each half out which also relieves strain on my shoulders. When I type, I never move my fingers more than one key away from homerow and I never move my wrists/palms. It's fucking great too. This is a relatively surface level coverage of this topic, and I know you probably don't even notice strain or anything right now but as soon as I switched, I felt it immediately in my shoulders and hands. I know this isn't exactly what you asked about but I promised wall of text.
Gamer boards are mostly gimmicks but what comes with them is a generally better typing expreince than your standard off the shelf membrane keyboard. And they really are the defacto gateway into the hobbyspace so I can't hate them completely.
I would say though, if you are looking for a new board, do some research. Look up a few reviews on Wooting and a few others. Figure out what you are after and get out if you don't wanna go down a rabbit hole inside a rabbit hole inside a rabbit hole. Don't stay too long because you might find yourself sitting on the credit card end of a new Key Cult case, 3 year waits on group buys and a pile of switches that need lubing and filming.
If I had to make a keyboard specifically for gaming, and I'm actually toying around with the idea of making a left half of one of these for a gaming pad, I would go with a Sofie or a Lily58. You get your dedicated number row for shooters and whatnot, but you get a less aggressive column stagger. Literally my only complaint about column stagger is with strafing with shooters since I need to drop my ring and index finger a bit too far for where A and D is on QWERTY. This is where ortholinear boards actually do better at but I digress.
I have a Wooting and it was world changing for me in games. The difference in actuation is extremely noticeable, not having to fully lift a key to reach "off" state in particular translates to 3-4 frames of gameplay at 60fps or 60-70ms or so if you prefer that way to look at it. 4 frames is A LOT in terms of engagements that are won or lost based on which person acted faster.
I've used reds in the past and hated them because I do a tonne of typing and reds felt absolutely awful to type with. I'm typing right now on a wooting and there's nothing wrong with it though.
Part of it might be the way they care about the keyboards too though. All their keyboards come with lubricated switches which must be a hand-built process.
Clicky switches are still better for typing imo, a membrane or nice tactile response just works better for it. But this is very serviceable for typing while having the advantages of no resistance for gaming.
The software for their keyboards is also leaps and bounds better than anything else I've ever seen.
So yeah. Personally I don't think this company is a gimmick. This was an interesting perspective though. If you get the chance to try one without paying (expensive) I do recommend trying one. They're smooooooth.
I think I need to read more into the way that these switches they use work. I definitely can see 3-4 frames being a big deal in situations. I'm not great at competative stuff where it really matters so it's not something I super focus on.
Pssst, I also don't fully get the trend with reds and really do think it's part of the gimmick. With that said, I am sitting on a set of Choc reds that I'm gonna put into something at sometimes and hate, just like what happened when I build my Sweep36 with Choc Robins(clickies with a slightly heavier spring).
Also I cannot express this enough but factory lubed switches are great. My Everglide Oreos in my ortho boards and my Choc Sunsets in both my Cantor Remixes and my Ferris Sweep all came factory lubed and it's just not something I wanna deal with myself lol. It's a meltdown waiting to happen.
I did check that their software is on github and wonder how it differs from QMK(what I use technically).
Also I wasn't meaning Wooting is a gimmick, I was referring to Corsair and Steel Series and boards like that. I'm really gonna try and keep an eye on them and see where they go. I appreciate you putting them on my radar. Me no good at conveying what I mean sometimes lol.
I think in the end of the day it's how they feel really. If Awoo likes them than awesome.
I never see anyone talk about my favorite MX style switch and think that anyone who likes Pandas or U4Ts should at least check them out at the very least(EG Oreo).
I think in the end of the day it's how they feel really. If Awoo likes them than awesome.
Oh for sure, I'm sure hall effect switches feel much different than regular linears, and more options is always a good thing in this space.
I never see anyone talk about my favorite MX style switch and think that anyone who likes Pandas or U4Ts should at least check them out at the very least(EG Oreo).
I just got into tactiles recently when I finally put in my Magic Girl SP-Stars and I really enjoy them. I'll definitely check out the EG Oreos when I get the chance to.
I think I need to read more into the way that these switches they use work. I definitely can see 3-4 frames being a big deal in situations. I'm not great at competative stuff where it really matters so it's not something I super focus on.
This is the important difference: https://wooting.io/rapid-trigger
When you lift, to any amount, it is "off". You can then press back in to be "on". It's very very noticeable.
You know how with a joystick if you press all the way left and then press all the way right there's all the space in between? Compared with pressing ADADADAD for strafing, a keyboard is just better for strafing than a joystick is in this regard because there's less input time between moving the joystick left/right/left/right.
Well for me this different between lifting a key and pressing it again is the same. You're removing all the time in lifting the key before pressing it again, which sounds like a minor optimisation on paper but in practice you feel it a lot.
I think this video explains very well: https://youtu.be/BSlKt7m7xXk
This makes sense. I'd like to compare them sometime but donno if money will ever dictate that. I literally can't type on a row stagger board anymore so It'd have to be the switches in a home built board. Gonna keep them in mind for if I ever get to making my gaming pad.
Ok, I think I misunderstood what rapid trigger was. My bad, sorry lol. I'd have to play around on a keyboard to get the feel for it. If I am reading it correctly, the switches aren't really drop in replacements for other MX based boards.
Literally my only complaint about column stagger is with strafing with shooters since I need to drop my ring and index finger a bit too far for where A and D is on QWERTY. This is where ortholinear boards actually do better at but I digress.
ESDF isn't optional with columnal stagger, it is much more comfortable.
What do you think of wooting? :3
E: I reread the first part of this and sorry if I sound a bit too blunt. I don't mean too and think people should be allowed to enjoy things. :(
So I usually don't really buy into the "gamer keyboard" thing but it's mostly because of the hype around marketing. The bigger name keyboards are kind of garbage and I don't think someone is gonna be a better gamer just because they can press a key a nanosecond faster.
But with that said, spring weight is absolutely a thing. linears like reds seem to be marketed towards gamers because they are around 35g spring weight so they are easier to press, but spring weight only really matters with regard to typing fatigue. So for me, as an example, I can type on 45g springs all day long but I tried out 55g Gateron Blacks for a while and hated them. My hands just felt tired and would get crampy after any amount of typing. I think this experience translates to gaming too. If you are doing a longer gaming session, spring weight is pretty important since I think the last thing you wanna get frustrated over when losing all day in Apex(that me) is your keyboard fighting you.
The video on their site when they cover activation point, that's just actuation and it's normal on mechanical switches. I've seen some discussion on Lekker switches but not a lot so can't speak fully on them but outside of like sound dampening and the D dumb style tactiles, there really hasn't been that much new innovation in the MX style switches. Cursious about the tiny magnet they mentioned though.
My current rec for anyone that is just wanting to get a mech is to go with Keychron but I will keep an eye on Wooting.
With all that said, my focus is on split, columnar stagger instead of row stagger. Our fingers naturally move up and down better than laterally and column stagger addresses this and row stagger doesn't. This is part of what causes repetitive injury in people that type a lot(carpal tunnel and ulnar deviation) Ulnar deviation is how your wrists are unnaturally bent outward while typing. My split boards allow me to adjust each half into an arch that matches the natural position of my hands, and I get to space each half out which also relieves strain on my shoulders. When I type, I never move my fingers more than one key away from homerow and I never move my wrists/palms. It's fucking great too. This is a relatively surface level coverage of this topic, and I know you probably don't even notice strain or anything right now but as soon as I switched, I felt it immediately in my shoulders and hands. I know this isn't exactly what you asked about but I promised wall of text.
Gamer boards are mostly gimmicks but what comes with them is a generally better typing expreince than your standard off the shelf membrane keyboard. And they really are the defacto gateway into the hobbyspace so I can't hate them completely.
I would say though, if you are looking for a new board, do some research. Look up a few reviews on Wooting and a few others. Figure out what you are after and get out if you don't wanna go down a rabbit hole inside a rabbit hole inside a rabbit hole. Don't stay too long because you might find yourself sitting on the credit card end of a new Key Cult case, 3 year waits on group buys and a pile of switches that need lubing and filming.
If I had to make a keyboard specifically for gaming, and I'm actually toying around with the idea of making a left half of one of these for a gaming pad, I would go with a Sofie or a Lily58. You get your dedicated number row for shooters and whatnot, but you get a less aggressive column stagger. Literally my only complaint about column stagger is with strafing with shooters since I need to drop my ring and index finger a bit too far for where A and D is on QWERTY. This is where ortholinear boards actually do better at but I digress.
Fascinating. I didn't expect so much.
I have a Wooting and it was world changing for me in games. The difference in actuation is extremely noticeable, not having to fully lift a key to reach "off" state in particular translates to 3-4 frames of gameplay at 60fps or 60-70ms or so if you prefer that way to look at it. 4 frames is A LOT in terms of engagements that are won or lost based on which person acted faster.
I've used reds in the past and hated them because I do a tonne of typing and reds felt absolutely awful to type with. I'm typing right now on a wooting and there's nothing wrong with it though.
Part of it might be the way they care about the keyboards too though. All their keyboards come with lubricated switches which must be a hand-built process.
Clicky switches are still better for typing imo, a membrane or nice tactile response just works better for it. But this is very serviceable for typing while having the advantages of no resistance for gaming.
The software for their keyboards is also leaps and bounds better than anything else I've ever seen.
So yeah. Personally I don't think this company is a gimmick. This was an interesting perspective though. If you get the chance to try one without paying (expensive) I do recommend trying one. They're smooooooth.
I think I need to read more into the way that these switches they use work. I definitely can see 3-4 frames being a big deal in situations. I'm not great at competative stuff where it really matters so it's not something I super focus on.
Pssst, I also don't fully get the trend with reds and really do think it's part of the gimmick. With that said, I am sitting on a set of Choc reds that I'm gonna put into something at sometimes and hate, just like what happened when I build my Sweep36 with Choc Robins(clickies with a slightly heavier spring).
Also I cannot express this enough but factory lubed switches are great. My Everglide Oreos in my ortho boards and my Choc Sunsets in both my Cantor Remixes and my Ferris Sweep all came factory lubed and it's just not something I wanna deal with myself lol. It's a meltdown waiting to happen.
I did check that their software is on github and wonder how it differs from QMK(what I use technically).
Also I wasn't meaning Wooting is a gimmick, I was referring to Corsair and Steel Series and boards like that. I'm really gonna try and keep an eye on them and see where they go. I appreciate you putting them on my radar. Me no good at conveying what I mean sometimes lol.
From a quick look, it seems like their 'lekker' switches are hall effect switches. In essence they can be fully analog.
It's definitely a really cool and interesting development for switches, but I still personally find them to be a bit gimmicky in concept.
I think in the end of the day it's how they feel really. If Awoo likes them than awesome.
I never see anyone talk about my favorite MX style switch and think that anyone who likes Pandas or U4Ts should at least check them out at the very least(EG Oreo).
Oh for sure, I'm sure hall effect switches feel much different than regular linears, and more options is always a good thing in this space.
I just got into tactiles recently when I finally put in my Magic Girl SP-Stars and I really enjoy them. I'll definitely check out the EG Oreos when I get the chance to.
Also I'll try and get to your other comment when I get back home. If you have design exp I might wanna pick your brain.
This is the important difference: https://wooting.io/rapid-trigger
When you lift, to any amount, it is "off". You can then press back in to be "on". It's very very noticeable.
You know how with a joystick if you press all the way left and then press all the way right there's all the space in between? Compared with pressing ADADADAD for strafing, a keyboard is just better for strafing than a joystick is in this regard because there's less input time between moving the joystick left/right/left/right.
Well for me this different between lifting a key and pressing it again is the same. You're removing all the time in lifting the key before pressing it again, which sounds like a minor optimisation on paper but in practice you feel it a lot.
I think this video explains very well: https://youtu.be/BSlKt7m7xXk
I found a YouTube link in your comment. Here are links to the same video on alternative frontends that protect your privacy:
This makes sense. I'd like to compare them sometime but donno if money will ever dictate that. I literally can't type on a row stagger board anymore so It'd have to be the switches in a home built board. Gonna keep them in mind for if I ever get to making my gaming pad.
Ok, I think I misunderstood what rapid trigger was. My bad, sorry lol. I'd have to play around on a keyboard to get the feel for it. If I am reading it correctly, the switches aren't really drop in replacements for other MX based boards.
ESDF isn't optional with columnal stagger, it is much more comfortable.
I technically use the equivalent of ESDF but it's because I have my QWERTY gaming layer shifted over one column.
the magic of QMK!
Honestly, It's kind of incredible. I use Vial which is even more amazing since you can edit layouts without reflashing.