Was looking at wikipedia page about the Holodomor cause I hate myself. Bad, as expected, but some of the numbers seem odd so I decide to speak at one of the sources.
The figure listed for the drop in grain production that year is, in fact, the drop in melon production, and is off by a factor of ten (7 million tons of melons vs. ~75 million tons of grain). Feelin like a middle school teacher right now.
BTW, the source they use is actually a really neat book by two professors of Russian history that says, among other things, that the death count used by the UN is well over double the actual number, and that the USSR made absolutely no attempt at genocide in Ukraine, so I'm a tankie now wtf?
Some guy on r/Communism looked through the history of the edits on that page and for most of the early-2000s a lot of them were from a Ukranian holocaust denier from Manitoba who kept trying to play up the hoaxodomor while casting doubt on the holocaust.
I've been imagining a Wikipedia that's not revisionist, propagandic garbage and how nice it'd be to have humanity's collective knowledge so accessible as Wikipedia but actually trustworthy. It'd be nice.
lmao. If you have the energy, someone should put that in the talk page or dispute the source. They'll probably do nothing, but at least it will create some busy work for the CIA.
Went ahead and did it. Turns out someone else had already questioned the same numbers a month or two ago, but didn't look into the source. Maybe it'll get changed.
I mean, there was absolutely a famine in Ukraine at the time that resulted in millions of deaths, there's no arguing that. The book I was looking phrased it reasonably well:
These were desperate and brutal men trying to cope with a crisis, not organisers of a deliberate famine.
Stalin had no reason to start a genocide in Ukraine or at all - the people getting sent to gulags were the kulaks, essentially the bourgeoisie landowners in rural Russia. People bitching about that are the same type as the former Cuban plantation owners that talk about how shitty Castro was.
Was looking at wikipedia page about the Holodomor cause I hate myself. Bad, as expected, but some of the numbers seem odd so I decide to speak at one of the sources.
The figure listed for the drop in grain production that year is, in fact, the drop in melon production, and is off by a factor of ten (7 million tons of melons vs. ~75 million tons of grain). Feelin like a middle school teacher right now.
BTW, the source they use is actually a really neat book by two professors of Russian history that says, among other things, that the death count used by the UN is well over double the actual number, and that the USSR made absolutely no attempt at genocide in Ukraine, so I'm a tankie now wtf?
deleted by creator
Some guy on r/Communism looked through the history of the edits on that page and for most of the early-2000s a lot of them were from a Ukranian holocaust denier from Manitoba who kept trying to play up the hoaxodomor while casting doubt on the holocaust.
I've been imagining a Wikipedia that's not revisionist, propagandic garbage and how nice it'd be to have humanity's collective knowledge so accessible as Wikipedia but actually trustworthy. It'd be nice.
Edit: Here: https://old.reddit.com/r/communism/comments/htpkir/investigating_the_origin_of_the_holodomor_article/
lmao. If you have the energy, someone should put that in the talk page or dispute the source. They'll probably do nothing, but at least it will create some busy work for the CIA.
Went ahead and did it. Turns out someone else had already questioned the same numbers a month or two ago, but didn't look into the source. Maybe it'll get changed.
absolute chad, well done comrade o7
deleted by creator
I mean, there was absolutely a famine in Ukraine at the time that resulted in millions of deaths, there's no arguing that. The book I was looking phrased it reasonably well:
Stalin had no reason to start a genocide in Ukraine or at all - the people getting sent to gulags were the kulaks, essentially the bourgeoisie landowners in rural Russia. People bitching about that are the same type as the former Cuban plantation owners that talk about how shitty Castro was.