I don’t know what the fuck the solution here is. I think it’s probably hopeless. Especially in this technological milieu, leftists in the US and Europe will always be flaky and run back to being libs at a moment’s notice- unless their material conditions are already severely affected, and even then they’re likely to misattribute blame according to the wishes of propaganda
In 4 weeks this is going to be one of the only funny things on this website.
You're deciding that because the media and internet, both completely astroturfed to convince you to not even fucking bother, are totally in lock step with this stupid war means that people will turn into nazis because CNN told them too. There isn't going to be some cataclysmic decline into fascism for the US, the Nazi's won WW2 and you already live in the 4th Reich and going further not only draws the ire of porky but everyone that's not a white suburban. I agree (blech) to a very limited extent that there's not much you can do for the time being, but that's because the only thing that would actually improve our lives (you know what it is, and why we can't post it on here) would be met with death. It doesn't make sense that a declining empire, that couldn't even hold onto Bolivia, is going to have that monopoly on violence forever, or even for the next decade.
It also doesn't make sense that the fash, who haven't garnered any good will towards any working class group, who are totally dependent on the state, who were outnumbered and outgunned at every demonstration for half a decade, and who are actively waring against themselves right now are somehow gonna pull off the day of the rope. Most importantly, this is a fash country. What they want is basically just this, and in the event of collapse, betting on "this" over a left that didn't have its leadership constantly murdered by the panopticon isn't a position I even kinda respect. It requires totally dismissing the history of the far right in burgerland in the last five years and a pessimism that doesn't line up with what actual people are saying.
You’re deciding that because the media and internet, both completely astroturfed to convince you to not even fucking bother
:this:
The most compelling antidote to doomerism I've seen is that, to be cliche, that's what they want you to think. If things were truly hopeless, and the world was truly locked in and all possible futures led to a monumental collapse of any class warfare of proletarians vs bourgeoisie, and we were doomed to a thousand years of fascist misery, then there would be no reason to keep this level of propaganda up. The media, as a totality, doesn't make that much money compared to other capitalist ventures and so its main purpose isn't to generate profit (paywalls and buying newspapers aside) but to control the narrative to ensure people don't rebel, and so would be culled by the very algorithm of capitalism that got us here if it was deemed unnecessary.
The point of propaganda warfare is to both convince the average person that things are good and fine (AKA :pinker:), and to convince those who may want to change things that change is impossible, that people are selfish, that revolution and class warfare are things of the past, and all-around not worth the effort. The second part is what fuels almost all the doomerism people have, as far as I can tell. You're smart enough to know that capitalism is a massively detrimental economic structure for billions of people and that communism is an inspiring alternative that will end widespread suffering, and smart enough to know that things are not fine, but then arbitrarily stop your counter-analysis when the media says "and it's impossible to change the way things are, so don't bother trying".
Capitalism and fascism are unstable systems that require an immense and constant amount of force, violence, and money to maintain. If there is deterioration of the kind that we're seeing right now as the West decays, and therefore a substantial weakening of the propaganda, then we won't go from an unstable system to another unstable system, at least not on any large scale either spatially or temporarily, we'd go to a more stable system; i.e. socialism and communism. Besides, as you say, the US did not even remotely cull the Nazis. They were propelled into all sorts of powerful positions. We're already in a quasi-fascistic regime, they've just realized that you can't do the whole death camp thing until it's strictly necessary and so held off on the worst parts while maintaining many of the Nazi's strategies. Where would we go from here - an explicitly even more fascist system that will collapse even faster as the contradictions accelerate? Rock bottom isn't much deeper; we have a lot we can win.
In 4 weeks this is going to be one of the only funny things on this website.
You're deciding that because the media and internet, both completely astroturfed to convince you to not even fucking bother, are totally in lock step with this stupid war means that people will turn into nazis because CNN told them too. There isn't going to be some cataclysmic decline into fascism for the US, the Nazi's won WW2 and you already live in the 4th Reich and going further not only draws the ire of porky but everyone that's not a white suburban. I agree (blech) to a very limited extent that there's not much you can do for the time being, but that's because the only thing that would actually improve our lives (you know what it is, and why we can't post it on here) would be met with death. It doesn't make sense that a declining empire, that couldn't even hold onto Bolivia, is going to have that monopoly on violence forever, or even for the next decade.
It also doesn't make sense that the fash, who haven't garnered any good will towards any working class group, who are totally dependent on the state, who were outnumbered and outgunned at every demonstration for half a decade, and who are actively waring against themselves right now are somehow gonna pull off the day of the rope. Most importantly, this is a fash country. What they want is basically just this, and in the event of collapse, betting on "this" over a left that didn't have its leadership constantly murdered by the panopticon isn't a position I even kinda respect. It requires totally dismissing the history of the far right in burgerland in the last five years and a pessimism that doesn't line up with what actual people are saying.
We will win. Log off.
:this:
The most compelling antidote to doomerism I've seen is that, to be cliche, that's what they want you to think. If things were truly hopeless, and the world was truly locked in and all possible futures led to a monumental collapse of any class warfare of proletarians vs bourgeoisie, and we were doomed to a thousand years of fascist misery, then there would be no reason to keep this level of propaganda up. The media, as a totality, doesn't make that much money compared to other capitalist ventures and so its main purpose isn't to generate profit (paywalls and buying newspapers aside) but to control the narrative to ensure people don't rebel, and so would be culled by the very algorithm of capitalism that got us here if it was deemed unnecessary.
The point of propaganda warfare is to both convince the average person that things are good and fine (AKA :pinker:), and to convince those who may want to change things that change is impossible, that people are selfish, that revolution and class warfare are things of the past, and all-around not worth the effort. The second part is what fuels almost all the doomerism people have, as far as I can tell. You're smart enough to know that capitalism is a massively detrimental economic structure for billions of people and that communism is an inspiring alternative that will end widespread suffering, and smart enough to know that things are not fine, but then arbitrarily stop your counter-analysis when the media says "and it's impossible to change the way things are, so don't bother trying".
Capitalism and fascism are unstable systems that require an immense and constant amount of force, violence, and money to maintain. If there is deterioration of the kind that we're seeing right now as the West decays, and therefore a substantial weakening of the propaganda, then we won't go from an unstable system to another unstable system, at least not on any large scale either spatially or temporarily, we'd go to a more stable system; i.e. socialism and communism. Besides, as you say, the US did not even remotely cull the Nazis. They were propelled into all sorts of powerful positions. We're already in a quasi-fascistic regime, they've just realized that you can't do the whole death camp thing until it's strictly necessary and so held off on the worst parts while maintaining many of the Nazi's strategies. Where would we go from here - an explicitly even more fascist system that will collapse even faster as the contradictions accelerate? Rock bottom isn't much deeper; we have a lot we can win.