Probably only if you are a principle engineer at FAANG and not even these days since the tech crash. But mrah someone who is ultimately also just a laborer made more money than me so they’re the problem.
But mrah someone who is ultimately also just a laborer made more money than me so they’re the problem
If we're friends that regularly hang out and they ask me to cover half of the 10 dollar Uber ride that they called or my 1 beer at the bar then yes, they're the problem
No surprise, the best tech friends I've had we never send money to each other unless it's in the order of hundreds. Anything else we just go back and forth on
All my tech friends who were dead set on going even for everything, even the ones that have offered to pay me 2 dollars for the movie popcorn that I bought, have all turned out to be neoliberals that don't care about anybody outside of their friend groups or tech/finance social circles
Find better friends? I don’t understand what them being tech people has anything to do with them being assholes. To be clear, what you’re describing is for sure asshole behavior. I have worked in relatively high paying and low paying jobs and have seen all types in all positions. Some people just suck
Not interested in a flame war but I would describe that as an inaccurate characterization of what I was saying. all I said is you’re mad at the wrong people
How am I mad at the wrong people? "Wealthy" people who do this suck and are assholes
You can actually be mad at the ruling class AND people who are working class if they're shitty. You don't get a pass on being an unreasonably selfish and greedy person just because you're a laborer lmao
This silicon valley techbro would be a class traitor during the revolution, and on some level, they know it, but are too cowardly to admit it. That's why they're pushing this #notalltechbros thing so hard.
Class traitors are good. I can't think of a successful revolution that wasn't full of them.
Why would they be "too cowardly to admit" being a good thing? Why are we so hostile to the same good thing that's featured prominently in every successful revolution? This is leaning towards ultraleftism.
Because they're a working class person who will side with the bourgeoisie. They aren't petit bourgeoisie, they use their own labour. Class traitors can go in either direction. Working class people can be convinced to work against their own best interests.
Everything is ultra-leftism to you, either that, or "stuff that won't build a mass-movement" when it's against the crackers. I don't think you have any ground to label what's good and bad to revolution anymore. I for one, am not putting my faith in fairweather fence-sitters when the last time we saw one of any prominence was a hundred years ago.
There are over 1.5 million software engineering jobs in the US and less than a third of them are in Silicon Valley. Neoliberal horizontal hostility trap. average software engineer makes around $150k. Yes that’s a fantastic salary beyond what many people could imagine but that’s not a quit your job at 40 kind of salary. Y’all are mad at the wrong people. Did you quit your job when the frito lay strike happened? Why not? No class solidarity smh
It's bourgeoisification theory - wealthy workers in the West have been bourgeoisified by the superexploitation of the third world proletariat and thus do not actually have the same class interests as the rest of the working class. Sure, they might not have "quit your job at 40" kind of salary, but they do not ever actually experience economic hardship alongside the rest of us.
Those people will never support socialism. You have to realize this.
I can say for a fact that some of them do, but it's definitely a lower percentage of the total when compared to average working class folk that support socialism.
What’s the cut off do you suppose? 100k? 150k? 70k? 40k? How poor do you have to be to count as a real socialist in your mind? Anyone who is having a portion of their labor being extracted by a capitalist owner can be radicalized. At worst you could classify middle class Americans as the petit bourgeois. Many have been fooled by being successful in a system where not everyone can be a winner but even Marx thought in the end the petit bourgeois would side with the proletariat. Look it’s not a great place to occupy for sure but the effort is to find coalitions not subdivide further
And anecdotally I find what you said to be untrue but maybe that’s just me
It's not a "cut off" it's a material relationship. Anyone who gets to have a portion of the superprofits from imperialism distributed back to them can be deradicalized by this material relationship. They materially benefit from cheap commodities produced in the global South, cheap imported fossil fuels (and cheap externalized costs of climate change), cheap food grown on the backs of undocumented workers, etc.
This isn't to subdivide the workers further, it's to explain why someone in a cushy software engineering job isn't going to want to sacrifice their comfort and security for the sake of strangers. They have no class solidarity because their class interests are not working class interests.
I think that this arrangement is decaying as the empire goes into decline - that's actually what "inflation" is! People who were once bought off by cheap commodities and energy and food are now finding their budgets squeezed tighter and tighter. We are all being de-bourgeoisified by the decline of the empire and will once again find our material interests realigned with the rest of the working class.
This was a historical anomaly produced by US hegemony and it's coming to an end.
Software engineers will be on the picket line with the rest of us soon enough.
I don’t disagree with any of that; I think we’re basically saying the same thing. I think ultimately what you described applies to all first world inhabitants, particularly Americans, regardless of their job. The cheap comforts of capitalism via third world exploitation even for low paid workers is a significant barrier to class consciousness but the magic sauce is quickly evaporating. We’ve all been brainwashed at some point in our lives and eventually we woke up. Everyone is on their journey, and we’re all going to be on the same side in the end. my goal is to reduce exclusionary rhetoric to accelerate that goal but ig that just comes across as “um ackshully” to some folks.
I think, in the first world, the cheap comforts of imperialism (and they are comforts of imperialism specifically, not just capitalism) don't actually get evenly distributed among all first world workers. It's all tied back to race, language, gender, religion, immigration status, etc. These internally colonized people within the imperial core are not beneficiaries of imperialism, they are only exploited by it.
The brainwashing is basically irrelevant imo - it's the material relationships that matter, people can't wake up from the reality that their own lives are materially better because they live on the backs of the superexploited global south and internal colonies within the imperial core. It's not a wake-up moment we need, it's organization of de-bourgeoisified workers and internal colonies within the imperial core.
Remember the BLM uprisings? That was a rebellion of internally colonized people against their imperial oppressors and was joined by debourgeoisified masses, which is why it also became the largest protest movement in American history. We weren't organized so the revolutionary energy burned itself out, but for me it serves as a stark reminder that America's chickens are coming home to roost.
As inflation continues and wages stagnate, those "cheap" commodities and energy and food won't be so cheap anymore.
And if we aren't organized we'll let yet another revolutionary moment pass us by - and we don't have a lot of those left!
You know what it's definitely a neoliberal thing though. Everyone responsible for only their piece of the pie, no more no less. In fact weigh the pie and they will just pay for price by weight at wholesale of the ingredients. See they have found the cheat to keeping their wealth and what all people should do.
Sure to make money you should be hiring cheap import labor from wherever you can get it and stealing as much of the money upwards to yourself as you can.
But we are all in this together, pay your share, it's only fair, unless I have more than you.
Probably only if you are a principle engineer at FAANG and not even these days since the tech crash. But mrah someone who is ultimately also just a laborer made more money than me so they’re the problem.
If we're friends that regularly hang out and they ask me to cover half of the 10 dollar Uber ride that they called or my 1 beer at the bar then yes, they're the problem
No surprise, the best tech friends I've had we never send money to each other unless it's in the order of hundreds. Anything else we just go back and forth on
All my tech friends who were dead set on going even for everything, even the ones that have offered to pay me 2 dollars for the movie popcorn that I bought, have all turned out to be neoliberals that don't care about anybody outside of their friend groups or tech/finance social circles
Find better friends? I don’t understand what them being tech people has anything to do with them being assholes. To be clear, what you’re describing is for sure asshole behavior. I have worked in relatively high paying and low paying jobs and have seen all types in all positions. Some people just suck
The tweet is just poking fun at the fact that the average tech bro is way more likely to be douchey
Can you stop doing the "akschually not ALL tech people" thing?
Not interested in a flame war but I would describe that as an inaccurate characterization of what I was saying. all I said is you’re mad at the wrong people
How am I mad at the wrong people? "Wealthy" people who do this suck and are assholes
You can actually be mad at the ruling class AND people who are working class if they're shitty. You don't get a pass on being an unreasonably selfish and greedy person just because you're a laborer lmao
This silicon valley techbro would be a class traitor during the revolution, and on some level, they know it, but are too cowardly to admit it. That's why they're pushing this #notalltechbros thing so hard.
Class traitors are good. I can't think of a successful revolution that wasn't full of them.
Why would they be "too cowardly to admit" being a good thing? Why are we so hostile to the same good thing that's featured prominently in every successful revolution? This is leaning towards ultraleftism.
Because they're a working class person who will side with the bourgeoisie. They aren't petit bourgeoisie, they use their own labour. Class traitors can go in either direction. Working class people can be convinced to work against their own best interests.
🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄
Everything is ultra-leftism to you, either that, or "stuff that won't build a mass-movement" when it's against the crackers. I don't think you have any ground to label what's good and bad to revolution anymore. I for one, am not putting my faith in fairweather fence-sitters when the last time we saw one of any prominence was a hundred years ago.
24-hours after edit: 🦗🎵, 🦗🎵, 🦗🎵, 🦗🎵
7-days after edit: 🦗🎵, 🦗🎵, 🦗🎵, 🦗🎵
https://www.shanley.com/blog/stop-feeling-bad-for-tech-workers-these-people-are-the-enemy
There are over 1.5 million software engineering jobs in the US and less than a third of them are in Silicon Valley. Neoliberal horizontal hostility trap. average software engineer makes around $150k. Yes that’s a fantastic salary beyond what many people could imagine but that’s not a quit your job at 40 kind of salary. Y’all are mad at the wrong people. Did you quit your job when the frito lay strike happened? Why not? No class solidarity smh
It's bourgeoisification theory - wealthy workers in the West have been bourgeoisified by the superexploitation of the third world proletariat and thus do not actually have the same class interests as the rest of the working class. Sure, they might not have "quit your job at 40" kind of salary, but they do not ever actually experience economic hardship alongside the rest of us.
Those people will never support socialism. You have to realize this.
I can say for a fact that some of them do, but it's definitely a lower percentage of the total when compared to average working class folk that support socialism.
Fair, there will always be class traitors.
They can't be relied on as a base of support though. They're atomized and cut off from struggle.
I want to not believe this. But my experience has been witnessing PMC, and tech workers especially, acting as defacto wreckers more than once.
What’s the cut off do you suppose? 100k? 150k? 70k? 40k? How poor do you have to be to count as a real socialist in your mind? Anyone who is having a portion of their labor being extracted by a capitalist owner can be radicalized. At worst you could classify middle class Americans as the petit bourgeois. Many have been fooled by being successful in a system where not everyone can be a winner but even Marx thought in the end the petit bourgeois would side with the proletariat. Look it’s not a great place to occupy for sure but the effort is to find coalitions not subdivide further
And anecdotally I find what you said to be untrue but maybe that’s just me
It's not a "cut off" it's a material relationship. Anyone who gets to have a portion of the superprofits from imperialism distributed back to them can be deradicalized by this material relationship. They materially benefit from cheap commodities produced in the global South, cheap imported fossil fuels (and cheap externalized costs of climate change), cheap food grown on the backs of undocumented workers, etc.
This isn't to subdivide the workers further, it's to explain why someone in a cushy software engineering job isn't going to want to sacrifice their comfort and security for the sake of strangers. They have no class solidarity because their class interests are not working class interests.
I think that this arrangement is decaying as the empire goes into decline - that's actually what "inflation" is! People who were once bought off by cheap commodities and energy and food are now finding their budgets squeezed tighter and tighter. We are all being de-bourgeoisified by the decline of the empire and will once again find our material interests realigned with the rest of the working class.
This was a historical anomaly produced by US hegemony and it's coming to an end.
Software engineers will be on the picket line with the rest of us soon enough.
I don’t disagree with any of that; I think we’re basically saying the same thing. I think ultimately what you described applies to all first world inhabitants, particularly Americans, regardless of their job. The cheap comforts of capitalism via third world exploitation even for low paid workers is a significant barrier to class consciousness but the magic sauce is quickly evaporating. We’ve all been brainwashed at some point in our lives and eventually we woke up. Everyone is on their journey, and we’re all going to be on the same side in the end. my goal is to reduce exclusionary rhetoric to accelerate that goal but ig that just comes across as “um ackshully” to some folks.
Also I like your username lol
I think, in the first world, the cheap comforts of imperialism (and they are comforts of imperialism specifically, not just capitalism) don't actually get evenly distributed among all first world workers. It's all tied back to race, language, gender, religion, immigration status, etc. These internally colonized people within the imperial core are not beneficiaries of imperialism, they are only exploited by it.
The brainwashing is basically irrelevant imo - it's the material relationships that matter, people can't wake up from the reality that their own lives are materially better because they live on the backs of the superexploited global south and internal colonies within the imperial core. It's not a wake-up moment we need, it's organization of de-bourgeoisified workers and internal colonies within the imperial core.
Remember the BLM uprisings? That was a rebellion of internally colonized people against their imperial oppressors and was joined by debourgeoisified masses, which is why it also became the largest protest movement in American history. We weren't organized so the revolutionary energy burned itself out, but for me it serves as a stark reminder that America's chickens are coming home to roost.
As inflation continues and wages stagnate, those "cheap" commodities and energy and food won't be so cheap anymore.
And if we aren't organized we'll let yet another revolutionary moment pass us by - and we don't have a lot of those left!
You know what it's definitely a neoliberal thing though. Everyone responsible for only their piece of the pie, no more no less. In fact weigh the pie and they will just pay for price by weight at wholesale of the ingredients. See they have found the cheat to keeping their wealth and what all people should do.
Sure to make money you should be hiring cheap import labor from wherever you can get it and stealing as much of the money upwards to yourself as you can.
But we are all in this together, pay your share, it's only fair, unless I have more than you.