I know it always supports big business. And it’s a reactionary force that people in power turn to when things go badly for the workers and they think of revolt.

But fascism also demands genocide and killing of millions of people and that would only hurt the capitalists, no? Because these are people who would otherwise be working and increasing profit used to increase productivity etc etc etc. But if you kill them you reduce the labor force and thus drive up the price of labor, reducing your profits, and thus what you can spend on improving productivity? And other countries which didn’t do so would become more advanced, leaving you behind.

  • Lymbic_System [none/use name]
    ·
    1 year ago

    Another way to look at facsim, is behind every fascism is a failed revolution the energy has to go somewhere and when the left fails it goes to the right. This definition helps correct I think miss understandings the modern left has with fascism, where everything is I don't like is fascism. It also if you read between the line there it means their isn't fascism because there is no revolutionary situation, their cant be a revolution to fail. Why isn't their a revolutionary situation? I'll leave that one up to you :thonk: hint it has to do with the left not being connected to the working class.

    • TreadOnMe [none/use name]
      ·
      edit-2
      1 year ago

      Hell no, the left and leftist ideology is and continues to be intimately connected to the working class in the U.S.

      The problem is that the media and education sphere we live in is entirely dominated by a false narrative of 'left (liberals) versus right (conservative)' when both sides are just different flavors of conservative liberalism. The only other well funded and popularized major media option out there is libertarianism, which twists leftist talking points into a neutered ideology of hyper-individualism, even though the entire political project is only bankrolled by four or five billionaires. You have to be a bored esoteric weirdo OR a completely disaffected radical progressive (which is just an incoherent form of liberalism) to even touch leftist discourse and even then, most will easily get caught up within online socdem discourse. Only the few, the proud, will brave the deep dive into actual historical leftist theory. Most of these people are not within academia or a party structure, but are within the bottom half of the working class, becoming any variety of flavor of esoteric ideology as they seek to explain the obvious inequalities around them (hey it me frfr).

      And then there are the minority on top of the minority that will actually join up with an organized party structure, but it's only in areas with a significant amount of radicalized population to begin to generate its own culture (Seattle, New York, etc.) that you actually see some level of coherent ideological sustainability.

      In countries without that level of media saturation or with larger population bases, leftist ideology and praxis is easier to sustain in contention with capitalist media.

      Fascists win because they are better funded than us, not because they are 'more intimately connected to the volkgiest'. That's literally a fascist talking point.

      • Lymbic_System [none/use name]
        ·
        edit-2
        1 year ago

        I guess what I'm trying to express is that the left dosent exist, I'm positing that we don't exist because the last 70 ish years we have spent not addressing why we haven't been able to form since the cp usa days, im just gonna link what I listend to and have you comment on it as I'm at work for the next 9 hours, I don't appreciate my point being called a fascist talking point kinda hurt my feelings ngl Episode is no royal road 2 I just think he makes good points idk what to say other then just listen to it. Another two good ones are the left in purgatory part one and two. https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly9mZWVkcy5idXp6c3Byb3V0LmNvbS8xNzc3NTY1LnJzcw/episode/QnV6enNwcm91dC0xMjQ0NDIzNg?ep=14

        • TreadOnMe [none/use name]
          ·
          edit-2
          1 year ago

          Hey, for what it's worth, I'm sorry. I'm not trying to jump down your throat here, it's just I've heard this expressed before as if the majority of explicit leftists in the U.S. aren't working class and are therefore not connected to the working class, which just simply isn't the case. I don't disagree that 'the left' as a coherent ideology and political movement in the U.S. doesn't exist.

          I'll give the Varn vlog a listen, he's a good egg but I'm always of the opinion that he gives too much historical credence to the importance of these internecine leftist conflicts to the development of the left, when the much broader issue is always one of access and control. It doesn't matter whose theory you adhere to if no one is ever going to read it outside of the cadre, and there is never going to be a significant cadre until the best funded and maintained circus in history begins to fail, and I have no real idea when that will be as the circus is the only thing that gets any level of funding, even at the expense of the production of 'the bread' these days. Entertainment is the only freedom, and control of it's creation is the grail we all seek to hold.

          Best of luck at work. Tough shift, but I believe in you!