That one seems overhyped too, I’d say.
Like Bullet Train, Glass Onion or The Menu last year. All good films but I felt they all lacked… something.
To be fair Glass Onion was meant to feel like it lacked something
For a few weeks, and then it'll be down the memory hole when Spider-Man: Across the Spider-Verse comes out.
This is all just entertainment for people. Nobody really understands what it means to bomb, much less to be bombed.
That is giving Nolan far too much credit, production started in 2020.
unless the last 20 minutes are set in Hiroshima, this is dogshit
specifically showing the historically accurate truth that like a quarter of the people that were killed were Korean slaves.
and all the Audience willroot for Oppenheimer to beat the Nazis , because what will the Nazis do with the Bomb when they have it ? They would probably use it ON CIVILIANS !
Eh, the Nazis weren't really building a bomb so much but if they were that would be basically the only defensible reason to participate in this project - it's basically the same argument for why the DPRK should have one.
how were the allies to know the heavy water was the only production the nazis were actually doing for it and not a small part of a larger program?
I don't know. I don't doubt the sincerity of most of the scientists involved, nor do I blame them for the US state incinerating hundreds of thousands of Japanese and Korean civilians.
But as for the reliability of intelligence at the time I don't really know.
i mean who'd believe the nazis dedicated limited wartime resources to materials for a bomb they had no chance of actually making, as some kind of kickback to IG Farben execs or something? lmao
Yeah I mean as I understand it they were mostly doing reactor research not bomb research, and a reactor is what you need the heavy water for anyways. But don't take my word for it I haven't scrutinized this carefully.
The scientists working in Nazi Germany didn't believe they would even be able to produce a bomb given what they thought it required, and thus they settled for a small nuclear reactor. When they were captured by Western forces they had their room bugged and most of their private conversations were transcribed at Farm Hall. They sincerely believed they were at the forefront of nuclear physics and that Churchill, Stalin, and FDR were just dying to meet them. It is true that when the bomb was dropped most were incredulous, and there were some who were "completely shattered by the news" with respect to the deaths caused such as Otto Hahn, who was an opponent of the regime. Others were incredulous merely to the fact that such a bomb was even possible. Heisenberg responded, "I don't believe a word of the whole thing. I don't believe it has anything to do with uranium" while Hahn jeered at him stating that, "If the Americans have a uranium bomb then you're all second raters. Poor old Heisenberg."
Essentially, one thing Adam Becker argues in his book "What is Real: The Unfinished Quest for the Meaning of Quantum Physics", is that Heisenberg and his student, Carl von Weizsacker, purposefully constructed a revisionist narrative of their wartime activities. The narrative is that "while the Americans had built a weapon of death and destruction on unprecedented scales, they, the Germans, had deliberately pursued only a nuclear reactor, being unwilling to build a massive new weapon for Hitler's Reich - thereby placing the responsibility for their failure on their supposed moral clarity, rather than their sheer incompetence."
While the Nazi project to build the bomb was a disorganized mess almost from the start, the Manhattan project accomplished exactly what Bohr thought was required, but was initially pessimistic about realizing. After he was flown to the US he was given a tour around the new facilities that had been built for the project and said, "I told you it couldn't be done without turning the whole country into a factory. You have done just that."
So yeah, there were scientists who did silent resistance such as Hahn, and even a few scientists who were open in their opposition to the Nazi's such as Hahn's buddy Max von Laue, but we should be weary of the sort of narratives constructed by "apolitical" scientists after the fact to excuse their participation with the Nazis. It's kind of analogous to other Nazi revisionist narratives. Of course the Soviets aren't superior in warfare, it's due to their being willing to send hordes of peasants to their deaths! Of course we Germans have the most sophisticated nuclear physics program unlike the US which is a scientific backwater. Thus you see it's not that we couldn't build a bomb, it's that we were unwilling to build such a destructive weapon! If only the Nazi's weren't so gosh darn virtuous maybe they could've won the war!
Sure, but building a reactor alone is not evidence of a nuclear weapons program.
To be clear comrade we don't really disagree - I said I don't blame the scientists. I think they were generally acting in good faith to prevent the Nazis from having an ultimate weapon that could not be countered. These scientists didn't drop a bomb on Japanese civilians.
in the 1940s, with nazis at the helm? it was a weapons program.
no hard feelings i just like to stress to people about ww2 especially how different perceptions and available facts could be during historical events and how the current historical perspective and narrative can be different but only because of hindsight and access to more information. it is impossible to banish the fact that we know some things people at the time didn't, but its important to appreciate they didn't.
i was just explaining why the allies were reasonable in the view the nazis had a nuclear weapons program, even though "the Nazis weren’t really building a bomb" is true.
im going to sneak an lmao onto the end of my second comment on second reading that came off as combative instead of 'get a load of these guys'
The most intriguing part of the trailer by far is that last 20%
Hoping against hope: what if this movie turns out to be a huge bait and switch and the creation and detonation of the bomb is only like the first 20-30 minutes of the movie??? What if the real meat of the movie is the literal and figurative fallout, particularly with regard to the cold war? If it were any other director than Chris Nolan I'd say its unlikely...but if anyone could get away with it...he could.
EDIT: Like its not just the Black and White part of it that stands out...just look at Matt Damon's character. People are saying he sounds like a Marvel Character....and I genuinely think that's intentional. Classic Handsome American movie star playing the military authority who spouts good old american witticisms isn't a cliche. It's a clue.
Oppemheimer actually takes places in kingsmen universe where hitler is thanos and is friends with lenin
Why is matt Damon actually doing the marvel dialogue thing lol I thought that was just a meme
This is 5% more CGI away from just being a Marvel Movie. They're literally doing Avengers Assemble with nuclear scientists.
Once more unto the radiation containment breach, dear friends!
Scientist explaining the theory behind nuclear physics
Army commander: "English brainiac!"
"Sure the nazis were defeated, but if we dont nuke Hiroshima the commies will take over japan!"
i was really curious about Oppenheimer's (the real life one) politics after I watched the trailer, and there's a section on his wikipedia worth exploring. Sounds like he was involved with a few leftist orgs over the years, so much so that the FBI were prepared to arrest him. His ties/sympathies with leftists seem like a primary cause of him getting fucked over by the US government and derailing his career - sounds like he kinda got fired and exiled by the gov't for it? idk
I'm curious to know more from other sources though, considering wikipedia gets a bit weird around politics
10 minute montage of him testing different quips and one liners in his study, desperately trying to figure out which one would sound the coolest the next day, while his wife keeps asking when he's coming to bed
Oppenheimer didn't :ackchyually: quote the Bagavad Gita until years after the Trinity test. He was giving an interview and claimed that's what he was thinking at the time. What he actually spoke was "...it worked...".
"I wouldn't exactly call them... People"
OP OP OPP, OPPENHEIMER STYLE
