Y’know people like to point to this and be like “oh so you guys refuse to debate? You must be afraid that your echo-chamber is not as secure as you think, I have some points that will really make you re-evaluate your stances” and yea at first glance any normal person will be like, ok let’s hear them out… now skip ahead like 3 years… those Mastur-debators were proven wrong and given book recommendations to help better define terms, better help understand key aspects of theory and class struggle/ societal structuring of class antagonisms, and history. You would think the Mastur-debators would be like “huh, I don’t actually know as much about Marxism-Leninism or Dial-Mat, etc. as much as I thought” but no! New ones pop up and ask the same questions, BEST CASE SCENARIO, they bring up a new point to be corrected. Worst case scenario: aka the most common one, they just parrot back the same talking points as the last one did, and we have to shut down debate and be like “bruh we already covered this please read this, I’m not typing out a whole 4 paragraphs, this is on you to do your research next time” and all of a sudden we’re tankies that don’t wanna debate because we’re afraid of it.
the most productive disagreements are between people who share a common foundation. the actual most likely result of sending a long effortpost in reply to someone like this is that they'll cherrypick pieces of what you said and try to paint you in the worst possible light - assuming they don't ignore everything you said and just ramble at length on whatever they feel like talking about. moreover, no one is owed your time. the fact that someone wants a debate doesn't mean you have to give it to them. this is all just basic social hygiene.
Anyone who thinks communists are in an "echo chamber" have never actually spoken to communists. I've gotten into far more actual debates and discussions about the most obscure shit in communist circles than I have anywhere else.
Some CHUD spouting the exact same "million billion dead authoritarian no ifone vuvuzela 1948" nonsense is not actually worth talking to.
What irritates me with the echo chamber accusation is that it's impossible to be in a communist echo chamber if you're an anglophone. Liberal values and tropes are so baked into every aspect of Western society that it's impossible to interact with English-speaking societies without being constantly bombarded by their horseshit and the harmful effects of it.
Communities like this one are less echo chamber and more like a sound-proofed booth to get some respite from the constant torrent of brain shitfuckery that comes with existing as an anglophone.
Y’know people like to point to this and be like “oh so you guys refuse to debate? You must be afraid that your echo-chamber is not as secure as you think, I have some points that will really make you re-evaluate your stances” and yea at first glance any normal person will be like, ok let’s hear them out… now skip ahead like 3 years… those Mastur-debators were proven wrong and given book recommendations to help better define terms, better help understand key aspects of theory and class struggle/ societal structuring of class antagonisms, and history. You would think the Mastur-debators would be like “huh, I don’t actually know as much about Marxism-Leninism or Dial-Mat, etc. as much as I thought” but no! New ones pop up and ask the same questions, BEST CASE SCENARIO, they bring up a new point to be corrected. Worst case scenario: aka the most common one, they just parrot back the same talking points as the last one did, and we have to shut down debate and be like “bruh we already covered this please read this, I’m not typing out a whole 4 paragraphs, this is on you to do your research next time” and all of a sudden we’re tankies that don’t wanna debate because we’re afraid of it.
the most productive disagreements are between people who share a common foundation. the actual most likely result of sending a long effortpost in reply to someone like this is that they'll cherrypick pieces of what you said and try to paint you in the worst possible light - assuming they don't ignore everything you said and just ramble at length on whatever they feel like talking about. moreover, no one is owed your time. the fact that someone wants a debate doesn't mean you have to give it to them. this is all just basic social hygiene.
Essentially the only arguements on the internet that have convinced me of anything were just the other person telling me to read this or that book
Libs:
Anyone who thinks communists are in an "echo chamber" have never actually spoken to communists. I've gotten into far more actual debates and discussions about the most obscure shit in communist circles than I have anywhere else.
Some CHUD spouting the exact same "million billion dead authoritarian no ifone vuvuzela 1948" nonsense is not actually worth talking to.
We almost have a need to invent an echo chamber just to avoid all the Judean People's Front and People's Front of Judea splits. ("Almost")
What irritates me with the echo chamber accusation is that it's impossible to be in a communist echo chamber if you're an anglophone. Liberal values and tropes are so baked into every aspect of Western society that it's impossible to interact with English-speaking societies without being constantly bombarded by their horseshit and the harmful effects of it.
Communities like this one are less echo chamber and more like a sound-proofed booth to get some respite from the constant torrent of brain shitfuckery that comes with existing as an anglophone.