cross-posted from: https://lemmygrad.ml/post/5268146

The Left In The Us Is Really Diverse

  • Cataphract@lemmy.ml
    ·
    5 months ago

    This is honestly the first I'm seeing of "All of Ukraine is a Nazi state". I've heard nazi mutterings in comments before but I don't really follow Ukraine like that apparently. Do you have some suggested reading for someone with an open mind to the facts?

    • zed_proclaimer [he/him]
      ·
      5 months ago

      2014 was a Nazi-led putsch, it integrated all neo-Nazi militias into the army and promoted them as generals and leadership. It installed Nazis into positions of secretary of the interior, governors of oblasts, chief of police, mayors and all other levels of civil and military governance. They then went on to ban Russian language and remove all soviet monuments and names, replacing them with pro-Bandera and pro-SS “heroes” of WW2.

      Up and down, top to bottom, the entire thing is an American led neo-Nazi project that’s intended as a battering ram against Russia from the outset

    • iie [they/them, he/him]
      ·
      5 months ago

      Nazis in Ukraine are almost a state-within-a-state. Not everyone in the Ukrainian government or military is a Nazi, but the Nazis are a dominant force.

      • zed_proclaimer [he/him]
        ·
        5 months ago

        If you fight alongside a Nazi you are a Nazi. All of the Ukrainian state is therefore Nazis for going along with the goose stepping fascists and aiding them.

        Just like American soldiers are terrorists and Daesh because it is them who created, fund, arm, train and facilitate Daesh.

        • iie [they/them, he/him]
          ·
          5 months ago

          true, but a lemmy user unfamiliar with our takes is not going to infer that's what we mean. They go off back to lemmy and repeat our take secondhand to other people, those people will tear into it because they also won't infer what we mean or give us the benefit of the doubt, and then the person starts to lose confidence in what we have to say.

          • zed_proclaimer [he/him]
            ·
            5 months ago

            I even think your take is too generous. 2014 was extremely thorough at embedding fascists at every level of governance. The entire state apparatus is so thoroughly penetrated and controlled by swatstika wearing Nazis that it’s correct to say the entire state is nazi, just as much as Germany in 1944. The “moderate non-Nazi” mythical beast you allude to doesn’t exist, they see the Nazis everywhere and salute just like the German “moderates” we gave West Germany to

            It’s not a minority of leadership pulling down the soviet statues and naming streets Bandera. It’s the majoritarian view of the government. There are more bonafide Nazi scum than not.

            • iie [they/them, he/him]
              ·
              5 months ago

              There are more bonafide Nazi scum than not.

              I always heard (or thought I heard) the nazis were only a dominant minority, leading an unresisting but non ideologically committed majority, but I’m realizing I don’t actually know that and I just absorbed that impression ambiently. It’s been a year at least since I followed the situation.