Yeah the comic reeks of PMC brainworms. I say that as someone with PMC brainworms. “You’re special enough to make decisions, but make sure you cultivate too much self-doubt to make true change.”
There's that joke about wearing regular clothes on Halloween to go as the "gifted kid", and when people ask what you're supposed to be you sigh and say you were supposed to be a lot of things.
I like the term “twice exceptional”. All of my biggest strengths are aspects of myself that come with tradeoffs. For 20 years straight, I was praised for the strengths and scolded for the tradeoffs. Motherfucker, you can’t enjoy how quickly I learn things I’m interested in and also treat me like I’m lazy when you expect me to sustain equal amounts of interest in 10 different things that bore me and I fail. You can’t enjoy all the art and tech I make and then get annoyed when it’s difficult to break me out of a hyperfixation.
I firmly believe that the tortured artist stereotype is bullshit. There’s nothing about being an artist that requires you to be miserable. But we sure do treat people like shit when their brains work differently.
The later half is so true, early on when you’re a statistical anomaly you can get special treatment, but once you become a small problem or the skill backfires they blow up as if it couldn’t have been seen coming. They expect 100% efficiency like you’re a battery to sap and don’t care how it affects you mentally.
I get what you mean… though, I feel like an IQ test is a biased test, I took one as a teenager and scored high. Which was a morale boost at the time, but a few months later I had medical problems and ended up having a stroke and had to basically start all over with speech, motor and memory.
Sure, I survived. But I went through every therapy, started back up and realized I wasn’t close to what I was before. Which was crushing, sure I knew it wouldn’t be the same and I’m still above average, but the latent memories of my capabilities before constantly haunt me.
I didn’t mean to depress anyone, just enjoy the blue zone if at all possible. I constantly try remembering, it can get worse. /hug
Fun fact: programs for gifted kids have historically been far more underfunded than programs for other exceptional students.
By the way, the euphemism of "exceptional children" pleases my autistic brain way more than any other word for Special Education students. It has all the compliment-sounding qualities of "Special Needs" but is even more literal than any previous euphemism. It literally means "kids that teachers need to make exceptions for"
"Gifted" programs royally screwed my education. I had huge gaps in my knowledge because they decided that being top percentile in reading/writing (and being the weird kid) meant I could just skip out on classes for special little weird classes or sit with higher grade classes. I just had ADHD btw and really liked to read. Anyway, I would LOVE to know wtf they thought they were doing moving a kid around that much in 3rd-5th. I suffered the hardest with math. I was missing bits and pieces, which is pretty gd important in math, and I'd still somehow get the answers right but talked to about my overly complicated or ✨creative✨ solutions lol. Even now I hide my work if I need to solve something because I'm probably doing it weird... Then later it was really fun finding out that I couldn't really live up to being "gifted". 0/10 being special made me less educated.
Skipping classes as a "gifted" kid always seemed like a very weird concept to me, you're making the child lose a lot of interaction with their peers for dubious reasons. It seems to me like it should only be reserved for the most bulging hyperwrinkled brains, like those kids that finish college by the time they're 16 or whatever that would obviously be extremely understimulated when going the normal pace. Even then you could argue the gigabrain kid would probably benefit greatly from socializing with their peers, I mean where's the rush really? They're young, they can always learn more later.
those kids that finish college by 16 usually just have parents that pay a fuckton of money to skip their kids through the honestly very simple and bleak public schooling experience. has nothing to do with intelligence and everything to do with not dragging out units for ages and paying a small fortune to get private tutors and certified testing done.
This isn't true at all. IQ isn't some magical catch-all measure of a person's intellectual ability, but it's not entirely total quackery either.
I suspect that academic success would be very strongly correlated with having a supportive home life, but IQ not so much. Maybe the gifted kids you refer to were the academically successful ones and not the high-IQ ones?
They once had me take one of those horoscopes and one part of it was a rorschach test. How is that not quakery.
Another part was to have me write a short text wich fair enough.
fill in mulltiple choise questions that were deliveratly obtuse and ambigous.
The only part that i would expect to corrrelaete with intelligence was when i had to memorize a string of numbers and repeat it after a while. But even then this is an ability you can train.
IQ is bullshit in the sense that as a measurement of cognitive abilities it doesn't really work, but that doesn't mean the only factor influencing intelligence is social upbringing either
i mean, say what you will, but i could have the most supportive environment on earth and i'm pretty sure i wouldn't ever be the second coming of messi (or michael jordan for you gringos), same should go for newton, knorozov or whoever
Of course. Humans are not clones. As long as they are not there is some variance due to physiological inherited factors.
That being said a lot of intelligence can be trained.
And a lot of it is culturally loaded. Im sure the average paleolithic hunter gatherer was smarter than me because they have to constantly solve complex problems. While people today rely on civilization to take on the load.
We dont actually do t need to be that intelligent know a days. And actually very few people relly care about it. For example there is some disiese going around that has about 7% chance of leaving you mentally handicapped. And you can catch it reapeatedly. No one really cares. Because they never came to a situation were their inherent intelligence was the bottleneck to solve a problem. Once eventually everyone loses 10or 20% of their intelligence they will still be fine.
So most of these asholes going woe is me im so samart. 1-Are not really that smart. 2-inherent phisiological limitations to cognitive avility have never been an actual limitation in their lives.
The iq is bullshit in the sense the the tests are bullshit. Only the part testing working memory relates to those innate charachteristics.
You are the one trying to start shit here. If you had a more nuanced response. In this case, an example would be descriving your experience. You would get a more nuanced response. See the other guy.
All I did was say I took an IQ test that didn't have any of the elements in yours. You came back calling me stupid.
Elaborate on how I started shit with you. Explain yourself. How the fuck do you envision yourself as being justified. How the fuck do you explain your perception of me starting shit with you.
Maybe on average, but you've got my ass who was put in the gifted program from 2nd grade on, with a single mom who was working two jobs and thus wasn't around much, and who couldn't afford childcare so I had to spend most of my before and after school time with my physically violent and abusive grandmother. Not that being in said program did much good (between the bad home situation and my ADHD, I was constantly in trouble at school), I didn't even finish my bachelor's in the end, but there were a few of us "smart" kids with fucked up home lives in there too.
Boy I sure wish I had a 6 hr video explaining the incredibly racist origins of the Bell curve which has no value at all scientifically speaking, perhaps even by a Liverpudlian narrator of sorts
You might need to elaborate. I'm confused at the Bell curve (which is a visual representation of the normal distribution) not having any value at all.
The Central Limit Theorem guarantees that the normal distribution will show up all over the place. To say that it has no value scientifically is simply false.
I was in the "gifted and talented" program as a kid and all it meant was I got more homework lmao. Good thing I loved reading and actually enjoyed being assigned novel chapters
I think I pretty quickly came to the conclusion that I was effectively being punished for understanding the normal material more easily than my classmates, and I didn't get why my "gifted and talented" work was necessary, since it was, to me, bonus material, and not even interesting bonus material.
A core memory of mine is after showing up one time without an assignment done, my teacher decided to go around the room asking what everyone wanted to be when they grew up. All my G&T classmates said standard kid answers like doctor, lawyer, firefighter, whatever. Not being a smartass, I gave the genuine answer that, because I really liked Taco Bell, and there was a taco bell in walking distance, I'd be happy to work there and get some free Taco Bell.
Teacher called my parents.
How the fuck was I supposed to know giving a real, and in hindsight significantly more attainable answer was unacceptable? We were in elementary school, so why the hell would I know at that point that basic food service is basically non-viable in America?
was just joking around with a sibling about how some of the most intensely "being highly intelligent is my identity" people from high school with supportive families grew up to be dumb as hell.
the gifted valedictorian became a nurse, then went full "iraq had WMDs, but it was classified" chud, quit the workforce to have 4 children, is a god-tier horder with rooms full of actual garbage, and now is entangled in several MLMs shoveling a spouse's very high income into a blackhole.
the "actually, i have a 160 IQ" inherited a bunch of $$, bought a bunch of vehicles, had 5 kids, went full blown "dance mom" facebook+social media freakshow, and spends most of their effort trying to cultivate inappropriate relationships and fabricate dramas with other married spouses in their neighborhood.
excellence and success are subjective. a life of curiosity, personal enrichment, family, and friends can be excellent without needing accolades or other features of careerist striving. but i'll be damned if some really "smart" people don't take their potential and, in defiance of the odds, turn it into a shit smoothie.
You sound bitter and cruel. Nursing is a wonderful profession that requires a lot of intelligence. There's nothing wrong with having children. Hoarding is a fucking mental disorder and one of the most intelligent men I know struggled with it.
As you get older, you sort of get used to the fact that the majority of your fellow passengers are oblivious to the fact we’re on a bus speeding towards a cliff, driven by depravity and delusions of grandeur. And you realize short of a miracle, nothing is going to change it. It’s either that or you go mad. ¯\(ツ)/¯
Gifted kids aren't necessarily smarter than anyone else. They just develop their adult levels of intelligence faster than normal. So there is no guarantee that the amount they will be able to maintain that performance gap going forward. Indeed, they are likely to do worse as they never had to develop the skills to do well in school. So once school gets hard enough for them to need those skills they don't have them.
The creator of this comic is a self-described pro-sweatshop neoliberal, which explains the "woe is me, I'm too smart for my own good" delusions.
Sure, because something so egregious would definitely show up in a Google search for "Zach Weinersmith sweatshop", right?
Unless...you're exaggerating on the Internet to stir up outrage?
Yeah the comic reeks of PMC brainworms. I say that as someone with PMC brainworms. “You’re special enough to make decisions, but make sure you cultivate too much self-doubt to make true change.”
I don't think he's ever come out in favor of sweatshops? Maybe you're think of Matt ygelsia from vox.
Do you have a source for that? I cannot find anything about it online in Google, Wiki or even in ChatGPT delusions.
There's that joke about wearing regular clothes on Halloween to go as the "gifted kid", and when people ask what you're supposed to be you sigh and say you were supposed to be a lot of things.
"I'm a homicidal maniac. They look just like everyone else."
Was this from Dexter? I feel like this is from Dexter.
I like the term “twice exceptional”. All of my biggest strengths are aspects of myself that come with tradeoffs. For 20 years straight, I was praised for the strengths and scolded for the tradeoffs. Motherfucker, you can’t enjoy how quickly I learn things I’m interested in and also treat me like I’m lazy when you expect me to sustain equal amounts of interest in 10 different things that bore me and I fail. You can’t enjoy all the art and tech I make and then get annoyed when it’s difficult to break me out of a hyperfixation.
I firmly believe that the tortured artist stereotype is bullshit. There’s nothing about being an artist that requires you to be miserable. But we sure do treat people like shit when their brains work differently.
The later half is so true, early on when you’re a statistical anomaly you can get special treatment, but once you become a small problem or the skill backfires they blow up as if it couldn’t have been seen coming. They expect 100% efficiency like you’re a battery to sap and don’t care how it affects you mentally.
Did you know that 80% of people think they're above average intelligence?
I wish my iq was 20 higher or lower, idk just gimme out of the blue zone
I get what you mean… though, I feel like an IQ test is a biased test, I took one as a teenager and scored high. Which was a morale boost at the time, but a few months later I had medical problems and ended up having a stroke and had to basically start all over with speech, motor and memory.
Sure, I survived. But I went through every therapy, started back up and realized I wasn’t close to what I was before. Which was crushing, sure I knew it wouldn’t be the same and I’m still above average, but the latent memories of my capabilities before constantly haunt me.
I didn’t mean to depress anyone, just enjoy the blue zone if at all possible. I constantly try remembering, it can get worse. /hug
IQ as used by worm-brained US citizens daily (that is, to measure intelligence) is pseudoscience
Thank god, it’s pseudoscience now. Though I was tested over 2 decades ago, it seemed silly they made a big deal out of it.
I always new IQ was inaccurate but I didn't know it was that inaccurate
Fun fact: programs for gifted kids have historically been far more underfunded than programs for other exceptional students.
By the way, the euphemism of "exceptional children" pleases my autistic brain way more than any other word for Special Education students. It has all the compliment-sounding qualities of "Special Needs" but is even more literal than any previous euphemism. It literally means "kids that teachers need to make exceptions for"
"well if those kids are so smart surely they can do more with less right?"
-average conversation at an budgetary meeting for education, probably
"Gifted" programs royally screwed my education. I had huge gaps in my knowledge because they decided that being top percentile in reading/writing (and being the weird kid) meant I could just skip out on classes for special little weird classes or sit with higher grade classes. I just had ADHD btw and really liked to read. Anyway, I would LOVE to know wtf they thought they were doing moving a kid around that much in 3rd-5th. I suffered the hardest with math. I was missing bits and pieces, which is pretty gd important in math, and I'd still somehow get the answers right but talked to about my overly complicated or ✨creative✨ solutions lol. Even now I hide my work if I need to solve something because I'm probably doing it weird... Then later it was really fun finding out that I couldn't really live up to being "gifted". 0/10 being special made me less educated.
Skipping classes as a "gifted" kid always seemed like a very weird concept to me, you're making the child lose a lot of interaction with their peers for dubious reasons. It seems to me like it should only be reserved for the most bulging hyperwrinkled brains, like those kids that finish college by the time they're 16 or whatever that would obviously be extremely understimulated when going the normal pace. Even then you could argue the gigabrain kid would probably benefit greatly from socializing with their peers, I mean where's the rush really? They're young, they can always learn more later.
those kids that finish college by 16 usually just have parents that pay a fuckton of money to skip their kids through the honestly very simple and bleak public schooling experience. has nothing to do with intelligence and everything to do with not dragging out units for ages and paying a small fortune to get private tutors and certified testing done.
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Get back to your green region you smart guy, we're having a moment of melancholy over arbitrary metric here.
IQ is bullshit. The gifted kids were just the kids that had supportive homelives
Human intelligence definitely varies. People in remedial education are not there just because they have poor home lives.
This isn't true at all. IQ isn't some magical catch-all measure of a person's intellectual ability, but it's not entirely total quackery either.
I suspect that academic success would be very strongly correlated with having a supportive home life, but IQ not so much. Maybe the gifted kids you refer to were the academically successful ones and not the high-IQ ones?
They once had me take one of those horoscopes and one part of it was a rorschach test. How is that not quakery.
Another part was to have me write a short text wich fair enough.
fill in mulltiple choise questions that were deliveratly obtuse and ambigous.
The only part that i would expect to corrrelaete with intelligence was when i had to memorize a string of numbers and repeat it after a while. But even then this is an ability you can train.
You won't find any of those things in any reputable IQ test. I'd be surprised if you found them even in a bullshit online test.
Maybe you just had a particularly bad experience and it has given you a false impression of what an IQ test is.
Maybe yoy just dont remember it well because you are not ver smart.
IQ is bullshit in the sense that as a measurement of cognitive abilities it doesn't really work, but that doesn't mean the only factor influencing intelligence is social upbringing either
i mean, say what you will, but i could have the most supportive environment on earth and i'm pretty sure i wouldn't ever be the second coming of messi (or michael jordan for you gringos), same should go for newton, knorozov or whoever
Of course. Humans are not clones. As long as they are not there is some variance due to physiological inherited factors.
That being said a lot of intelligence can be trained.
And a lot of it is culturally loaded. Im sure the average paleolithic hunter gatherer was smarter than me because they have to constantly solve complex problems. While people today rely on civilization to take on the load.
We dont actually do t need to be that intelligent know a days. And actually very few people relly care about it. For example there is some disiese going around that has about 7% chance of leaving you mentally handicapped. And you can catch it reapeatedly. No one really cares. Because they never came to a situation were their inherent intelligence was the bottleneck to solve a problem. Once eventually everyone loses 10or 20% of their intelligence they will still be fine.
So most of these asholes going woe is me im so samart. 1-Are not really that smart. 2-inherent phisiological limitations to cognitive avility have never been an actual limitation in their lives.
The iq is bullshit in the sense the the tests are bullshit. Only the part testing working memory relates to those innate charachteristics.
What's funny is I got an IQ test in 5th grade and absolutely nothing you listed was in mine
Maybe you just dont remember it well because you are not very smart.
Don't know why you're trying to start shit with me but please go fuck yourself.
You are the one trying to start shit here. If you had a more nuanced response. In this case, an example would be descriving your experience. You would get a more nuanced response. See the other guy.
But im glat i touched a sore spot for you.
All I did was say I took an IQ test that didn't have any of the elements in yours. You came back calling me stupid.
Elaborate on how I started shit with you. Explain yourself. How the fuck do you envision yourself as being justified. How the fuck do you explain your perception of me starting shit with you.
Maybe on average, but you've got my ass who was put in the gifted program from 2nd grade on, with a single mom who was working two jobs and thus wasn't around much, and who couldn't afford childcare so I had to spend most of my before and after school time with my physically violent and abusive grandmother. Not that being in said program did much good (between the bad home situation and my ADHD, I was constantly in trouble at school), I didn't even finish my bachelor's in the end, but there were a few of us "smart" kids with fucked up home lives in there too.
Boy I sure wish I had a 6 hr video explaining the incredibly racist origins of the Bell curve which has no value at all scientifically speaking, perhaps even by a Liverpudlian narrator of sorts
a bell curve is just a normal distribution lol
do you mean the BOOK "The Bell Curve"? the frenology book? yeah i think most of us here get that frenology is racist
do you mean the racist origins behind IQ?
I meant this video
Here is an alternative Piped link(s): https://piped.video/watch?v=UBc7qBS1Ujo&
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I'm open-source, check me out at GitHub.
You might need to elaborate. I'm confused at the Bell curve (which is a visual representation of the normal distribution) not having any value at all.
The Central Limit Theorem guarantees that the normal distribution will show up all over the place. To say that it has no value scientifically is simply false.
i am making a joke about the youtuber skullboi shaun and his very longform essay methodology, especially this video on the bell curve book
Here is an alternative Piped link(s): https://piped.video/watch?v=UBc7qBS1Ujo
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I'm open-source, check me out at GitHub.
I was in the "gifted and talented" program as a kid and all it meant was I got more homework lmao. Good thing I loved reading and actually enjoyed being assigned novel chapters
I think I pretty quickly came to the conclusion that I was effectively being punished for understanding the normal material more easily than my classmates, and I didn't get why my "gifted and talented" work was necessary, since it was, to me, bonus material, and not even interesting bonus material.
A core memory of mine is after showing up one time without an assignment done, my teacher decided to go around the room asking what everyone wanted to be when they grew up. All my G&T classmates said standard kid answers like doctor, lawyer, firefighter, whatever. Not being a smartass, I gave the genuine answer that, because I really liked Taco Bell, and there was a taco bell in walking distance, I'd be happy to work there and get some free Taco Bell.
Teacher called my parents.
How the fuck was I supposed to know giving a real, and in hindsight significantly more attainable answer was unacceptable? We were in elementary school, so why the hell would I know at that point that basic food service is basically non-viable in America?
I reject uniform distribution theory and only recognize the graph that looks like a pair of torpedo titties.
I can’t unsee it now.
was just joking around with a sibling about how some of the most intensely "being highly intelligent is my identity" people from high school with supportive families grew up to be dumb as hell.
the gifted valedictorian became a nurse, then went full "iraq had WMDs, but it was classified" chud, quit the workforce to have 4 children, is a god-tier horder with rooms full of actual garbage, and now is entangled in several MLMs shoveling a spouse's very high income into a blackhole.
the "actually, i have a 160 IQ" inherited a bunch of $$, bought a bunch of vehicles, had 5 kids, went full blown "dance mom" facebook+social media freakshow, and spends most of their effort trying to cultivate inappropriate relationships and fabricate dramas with other married spouses in their neighborhood.
excellence and success are subjective. a life of curiosity, personal enrichment, family, and friends can be excellent without needing accolades or other features of careerist striving. but i'll be damned if some really "smart" people don't take their potential and, in defiance of the odds, turn it into a shit smoothie.
You sound bitter and cruel. Nursing is a wonderful profession that requires a lot of intelligence. There's nothing wrong with having children. Hoarding is a fucking mental disorder and one of the most intelligent men I know struggled with it.
you sound like you are entangled in several MLMs.
I don't mind being aware of everything, but I do mind that nobody else is
As you get older, you sort of get used to the fact that the majority of your fellow passengers are oblivious to the fact we’re on a bus speeding towards a cliff, driven by depravity and delusions of grandeur. And you realize short of a miracle, nothing is going to change it. It’s either that or you go mad. ¯\(ツ)/¯
Gifted kids aren't necessarily smarter than anyone else. They just develop their adult levels of intelligence faster than normal. So there is no guarantee that the amount they will be able to maintain that performance gap going forward. Indeed, they are likely to do worse as they never had to develop the skills to do well in school. So once school gets hard enough for them to need those skills they don't have them.
Like I'm even good enough to have imposter syndrome.