Damn, we found their trigger word! Lesser evil! LESSER EVIL!
It's funny how hypocritical you are right now, too. You wanna label "liberals" as fascist, but get all pissy when the same happens to you with the same amount of credibility.
What's funny is that you lot all seem to fail to realize that "Liberalism" is not inherently left or right wing, unless you are a reductionist who doesn't believe that social liberalism exists and only believe Classic Liberalism exists. You all talk big about your political knowledge and how nuanced your beliefs are, and then you fall victim to the classic conservative notion of reductionism. Seeing "lib" used as an insult around here is just as hilariously pathetic as all the "snowflake" shit
I never called a lib a fascist. Liberalism is inherently right wing because its the ideology of capitalism. I understand that there's distinctions between different types of liberals, and between them and fascists. I did call libs like you and the other poster, to use their phrase "the lesser evil" because you support capital but arent fascists.
If you don't like being lumped in with other right wing tendencies then stop supporting capital. Its not our fault that reality is marxist
Why are you lot so obsessed with reddit? Can't you leave that place behind? I mean, haven't you ever thought that people on reddit talk the way they do because its how most people online in general talk? Reddit didn't invent linguistic trope. I digress.
And what makes you think I am a libertarian? What makes you think I support capitalism? Just because I don't directly support your exact ideology doesn't mean you get to straw man the criticism away. You and your ilk with that and ad hominem, or some other fallacy. Never able to directly hold an argument on it's own merits. It's fuckin hilarious lmao
Why are you lot so obsessed with reddit? Can't you leave that place behind?
Can you blame people for being reminded of Reddit when you and your posts reek of Reddit?
I digress.
You and your ilk
ad hominem
Pretentious shit like that is the stench of Reddit.
And what makes you think I am a libertarian?
So far you've claimed not to be a liberal and not to be a libertarian, so if you're one of those very tiresome "I have no political ideology" bullshit artists trying to dodge labels to seem extra enlightened, as seems to be the case, that's actually a move that has overlap with both.
It's fuckin hilarious lmao
You like it that
It's funny that
It's ironic that
It's interesting that
Reddit minded people like yourself keep trying to mask their rage behind such tiresome "totally not mad" sentence fillers.
Lmao, you are one to talk about being pretentious. Hypocrisy is definitely your watchword.
Also, dont know why my comment said libertarian, definitely meant to write liberal and my shit must have autocorrected. I definitely have a political ideology, and its democratic socialism, which staunchly criticizes Marxist-leninist ideology. Like I said before, I dont agree with your philosophy but that doesnt make me a liberal or right-wing or anything. We agree on a lot of fundamental ideals, but theres a lot of disconnect, too.
I know you folk always have a "you're with me or you're against me" attitude, which makes sense considering your authoritarian nature. I think its just fun how easy it is to set you off. I mean, I can leave one half-baked comment and you guys swarm like vultures! I can see how the gish gallop is so successful.
So you're one of those people that only support socialists who lose. Not a lot of room to talk about hypocrisy then, that's your whole ideology. Makes sense you're also into using logic pedant terms
What are you even talking about? This is the least comprehensible comment I've seen here. Everything you've said here has nothing to do with anything I've said; it's the trifecta of straw man, non sequitur, and red herring. And using terms for logical argumentation doesn't make me pedantic, it makes me able to precisely detail why and how your logic doesn't work. I can see why you are afraid of that.
And, predictably, when all else fails, you basically resort to "no u"
You non-sequitur-ed, you double straw man-ed, you red herring-ed. Its not pedantic unless its from the pedant region of France. This is just sparkling smugness.
Ipso facto absurdeum, Checkmate tankie
I'm sorry that you couldn't comprehend my post, i was being pretty clear. You're one of those western left anti-communists. You dont support actually existing socialist states. You think the men and women of the world who have fought revolutions and built real world socialist projects did it, or are doing it wrong. People like that usually have admiration for socialists who failed to bring a project into the real world, where their actions could be critiqued, where mistakes can happen and be visible, because only projects that aren't real can live up to your idealist vision of socialism.
Mocking you for logic pedantry, and reddit debate bro bullshit to be fair is technically unrelated from your "ideology." But there's an obvious connection to how people who don't find actual real world socialist projects worth supporting would also be into flinging thise terms around like anyone outside of online debate perverts would care
Damn, that's a lot of wrong assumptions about me you just made. I can see that you lack the intelligence to actually see that I never really said much about my own ideology, so basically anything that you just tried to claim about me was pulled deep from inside your anus, and is objectively wrong. For the most part I actually support even communist states, but my main criticism with actual communist states is their authoritarianism, made easy by the inherent totalitarianism of communism.
Big problem with your criticism tho: there aren't any true socialist states that exist today. There aren't any states that have successfully fully implemented a socialist society today. A society where the actual individual workers own and control all the means of production, where all basic needs are met, and people are guaranteed the right to their freedoms. I absolutely support and laud the people out there working to achieve those goals. I don't think any state will ever be able to perfectly achieve those goals, so I don't expect perfection out of my fellow socialists. I do expect the abolition of the class, however, and that has never really even been close to being achieved. Not for a lack of trying, but because there is always some asshole who wants to be above others, and they have been very good at fucking things up for the rest of us.
And, you know, that gets me thinking... this whole conversation is exactly what capitalists want; infighting. You think I'm not radical enough for you, so you then label me as completely opposed to you. The problem is, I can guarantee we share a great many ideals, but you are too busy gatekeeping to allow others with slightly different but reconcilable ideals to be allies.
That is, of course, if I suspend my disbelief that you are a capitalist troll who is spitting vitriol, trying to make communists look belligerent and inhospitable.
Your explanation of your beliefs just proved me right. My thoughts about you didn't come from my ass they honestly came from Michael Parenti Black Shirts and Reds
All governments are authoritarian, its a useless word. I didn't make that up either. Its from Engels On Authority
Totalitarian is a bullshit concept invented during the Cold War to conflate fascism with communism, similar to double genocide theory, to use against communist states. To say its inherent to communism is like saying killing 10 gorillion dead, Vuvvezzuula, no food, no iphone, is inherent to communism.
You believe these things because you're a left anti-communist. You can say that you arent, and then continue to describe to us all the ways that you are again if you want.
And, you know, that gets me thinking...
No, no it hasn't gotten you thinking. If we share values, then why do you attack us. There's more than once where you've popped off saying something weird directed at us. If you think our differences are reconcilable, why not lead with that?
Instead you started with TRIGGER WORD, and some comment about us being the same as fascists by saying we're like Hannah Montana or something. Then you dicked around flinging out your straw mans and ad hominems and no true scotsmans instead of telling us about your ideology or making a real critique about ours.
And, you know, that gets me thinking... this whole conversation is exactly what capitalists want; infighting. You think I'm not radical enough for you, so you then label me as completely opposed to you. The problem is, I can guarantee we share a great many ideals, but you are too busy gatekeeping to allow others with slightly different but reconcilable ideals to be allies.
Gatekeeping? That was always the issue I had with "democratic" socialists who have positions, but insist that they're the 'democratic' ones because they want to make sure the slaveowners keep getting a vote (and continue existing).
Yes I go into a phone booth as my normal commie antifa self and come out as Chudly Dugsfermpt local pool supply company owner and lover of Milton Friedman
meanwhile in the real world it's liberals and fascists who are joined at the hip https://orgrad.wordpress.com/articles/liberalism-the-two-faced-tyranny-of-wealth/
Yes, every night I stop being a bisexual trans communist and put on my MAGA-Man leotard superhero suit and start ranting about immigrants and the woke gender ideology to people on the street
I think that’s awful an immature behavior.
When you fight idiocy with aggression (at least on social media) you just get idiots who think they must be right and start truth social or something
I find that a lot of crazy right wingers do it to “own the libs” or get a rise out of their supposed enemies.
It’s all just a sports game to people like that.
If you ignore them they get bored and stop being so staunch in their awful beliefs. When you fight with them it makes them feel like they’re right. You end up forcing them to rationalize every shitty position.
Almost nobody posts on the internet trying to challenge and reconsider their beliefs, so it’s not like you’re going to change their mind anyway.
Does ignoring the fascists make them go away? Please.
If you ignore them they get bored and stop being so staunch in their awful beliefs. When you fight with them it makes them feel like they’re right. You end up forcing them to rationalize every shitty position.
So now you're accusing us of making fascists more fascist, as an excuse for your ridiculous theory of just ignoring fascism.
like you’re going to change their mind anyway.
Its not even about changing their minds. Its about forcing them out of shared spaces. Fascists should driven out, shamed, harassed, and redacted.
What you think is lib bullshit that gets your spaces infiltrated and taken over by fascists and reactionaries.
You want to ignore them fine, but don't condescend to people who confront them and drive them out of shared spaces as if you have a more "mature" solution. Your solution is literally "if i close my eyes they go away" baby logic
We actually study history and read shit. Like I just finished reading Long Walk to Freedom & Armed and Dangerous, both are a fairly good firsthand on how "fascists" respond to non-violence and only start to have reservations when the oppressed shoot back.
It’s just polarizing.
You’re just making people more staunch in their beliefs or just annoying people who would rather not deal with aggression (like myself)
If your goal is to drive people away and make a space where everyone just agrees with you all the time then it’s effective.
This is really the point to hammer home. Back in my lib days, I started hanging out with a dude who was much cooler than me, and his anarchist friends. We once got to talking about how our town used to have a pretty substantial neo-nazi presence, in the 80s-90s. I said something to the effect of "good thing people are smarter today!" and he and his friends got really animated and saying how "they didn't just go away one day, we fucking chased them out of here!"
While at first I just didn't like getting yelled at, it eventually dawned upon me that that he was right. I, and everyone I had ever talked to about it (other libs), just assumed that that whole unpleasant nazi thing just went away, through the magic of progress, presumably. It was just a thing that was there once, now wasn't. People like him and his friends (and I've since met many more) were the actual people who went out and risked life and limb to oppose the nazis everywhere the went, to vandalize their posters and stickers the moment they went up, to show up in numbers every time there was a demonstration. To do everything to make life as shitty as possible for these pieces of shit until it just wasn't really viable to be a nazi in our town anymore.
That whole realization did a lot to cure me of my "we can't sink to their level"/freezepeach brainworms.
Polarization is clarifying. It drives away fascists which protects their targets and makes spaces safe for them. It also exposes people who would more readily share spaces with fascists and just ignore them than with the people who oppose them.
If it drives away people like you who ignore fascism, yet want to argue that opposing it is immature, then that's a bonus
When you fight with them it makes them feel like they’re right. You end up forcing them to rationalize every shitty position.
Literal fascist talking point. "Look what you made me do"
I mean that’s what I think, at least
Investigate before you start thinking next time. Are trans children out there looking for fights just by existing or is your belief that fascists need to be provoked first founded on nothing but bullshit?
Yknow I’m talking about on social media platforms, right?
Frothing at the mouth raging at someone on a social media platform doesn’t do anything but cause more radicalization, so I just ignore people instead. I don’t spend most of my life fighting with people on the internet over politics.
I don’t spend most of my life fighting with people on the internet over politics.
You won't push back on fascists, but you can't shut up when pushing back against people who believe in pushing back fascism.
cause more radicalization
Its been pointed out multiple times now that this is literally a fascist talking point. Pushing back against fascism is not what makes people fascist. In fact its how we protect the targets of fascism on shared spaces online or off.
As has also been pointed out to you some people just existing is seen as an incitement by fascists. What are they supposed to do? They can't just ignore threats and the invalidation of their humanity. That you can shut your eyes to that says a lot about you.
Great to hear that the targets of fascism "can do whatever they want." They don't have a choice in the matter of being a target, unlike you obviously.
I've already told you this but our goal isn't to change fascists minds. Its to drive them away, to shame them. To not allow them to spew their bullshit or attack their targets without resistance.
Pushing fascists out of our spaces is the only way people whose existence is targeted by fascism can actually "do whatever they want."
I have no goal here. Just sharing my opinions. Not failing to do anything.
Yeah being aggressive is good for driving people away. And yknow given that your goal is actually to drive people away I was wrong to say it’s immature.
I just don’t like aggression. I don’t go on the internet looking for fights.
Regardless of handwringing about it, the fact remains that we've driven out and proud fascists off of lemmy instances that we're federated with. The simple existence of hexbear pulls the Lemmy overton window so far left that social democrats are now the right wingers - this is a good thing.
The -oid suffix, as an insult, has a long history of ableism and racism. Maybe you should work on being better instead of projecting your bigotry by appropriating Marxist-flavored gotchas
Im looking through several hate speech websites and I'm not seeing a single thing about what you saying, anyway. Just a single reddit post (ofc) with no linked information.
I am sorry (to myself I guess) for using bigoted language (... to myself? like who am I hurting here besides using language that targets me) and I would love for more information on the subject. If I'm wrong, im happy to take the L and throw such language away.
but here revised:
You are a fake leftist that simps for imperialist and colonialist organizations founded in collaboration with nazis. You are useless to the worldwide movement and no matter how hard you work, you will be doing so in the wrong direction, and would be as useless as you are right now. You use problems of people far worse off than yourself as a shield to help ignore everything you do wrong when you should be using it to look at yourself. You "don't care how anyone identifies" until it is used against you. You ignore the actual fascists and racists because they would not harm you, and you know it. Go take your nonsense to someone who would actually care, you sorry excuse for a leftist. Your liberalism will never be accepted anywhere that has anything more than surface level political knowledge, and that is completely fine by me.
You are a fake leftist that simps for imperialist and colonialist organizations founded in collaboration with nazis. You are useless to the worldwide movement and no matter how hard you work, you will be doing so in the wrong direction, and would be as useless as you are right now. You use problems of people far worse off than yourself as a shield to help ignore everything you do wrong when you should be using it to look at yourself. You "don't care how anyone identifies" until it is used against you. You ignore the actual fascists and racists because they would not harm you, and you know it. Go take your nonsense to someone who would actually care, you sorry excuse for a leftist. Your liberalism will never be accepted anywhere that has anything more than surface level political knowledge, and that is completely fine by me.
that gives a 404 error message with a picture of nixon.
Idk what's up with your browser then it's hatebase.org/vocabulary/removed
Don't act like your infantile scrawl deserved anything but an equally infantile response
Edit: Since others can't see the link, suffice to say that -oid insults are based on outdated words for people with downs syndrome, and those of obsolete race "science."
Obviously the -oid suffix can also mean "like," but that is not the context in which it is used as an insult.
Ah, well maybe that's why the link wouldn't work in the first place? Oh well, thanks for explaining. Edited to provide some context for those that can't use the link
Keep up? You mean like stay on the page and hit refresh a bunch to stay up to date?
And how are you acting condescending right now? You had this whole long argument because you believed the -oid suffix held the meaning of a slur that used it. You looked up the thing you already thought instead of looking up the thing you were encountering.
you believed the -oid suffix held the meaning of a slur that used it.
Not what I said. I'm saying it's used in reference to multiple slurs because it is. Unless calling me a natoid is supposed imply that I'm like NATO, but it's not. It's meant to imply that people who support NATO are mentally deficient, and so it's a reference to a slur
Here's a bare-bones answer to get whether or not you're a right-winger or Left-winger. I emphasize again, this is a bare-bones answer that's leaving out a lot of other stuff.
Who should have ownership over the means of production, or Capital Goods if you want to use non-marxist lingo. If you say the working class should have ownership over the means of production then you're left-wing. If you say capitalists should have ownership over the means of production then you're right-wing.
Yeah I can get behind this, and I'd say you're right that it's the bare-bones definition of the economic left vs right divide.
But then you have people who will look at market socialists, anarchists, or some other brand of leftism and call them secret fascists or something like that. It's my experience (and yours may differ) that MLs are eager to insist that theirs is the only way and dismiss the rest.
Not all MLs are this dogmatic. But when a leftist is this dogmatic, they always seem to be ML
fake Marxists who ignore the basics of marxist? heck yeah we hate them. I've yet to see any fake anarchists or MLs on hexbear that werent immediately banned tho
But then you have people who will look at market socialists, anarchists, or some other brand of leftism and call them secret fascists or something like that. It's my experience (and yours may differ) that MLs are eager to insist that theirs is the only way and dismiss the rest
What you're describing is the analysis of Marxism-Leninism on other socialist tendencies based off of the historical materialist end results of their respective ideologies. A very simple example of this would be is how Marxists would prod anarchists as being more idealist over materialist over the fact that the more idealist members of the anarchist faction advocate for the immediate and total abolishment of the penal system can't reconciliate the fact that anarchists reestablished the penal system during the Spanish Civil War on their turf due to the material conditions they faced forcing them to make that decision. There's a lot more to this discussion that's being left out with plenty of worthwhile perspectives from all Left factions on the civil war in regards to this and much more.
It's in this regard that marxists will ruthlessly critique all ideological threads and each other all in the name of finding the most materially realistic path to Socialism within their respective home countries - and historically, revolution is the only means to the goal of establishing the dictatorship of the proletariat and a scientific socialist society.
There is not a valid distinction between economic left and political left, or economic right and political right.
There is the left and its various tendencies and ideologies (anarchists, communists, MLs, etc.) And the right and its various tendencies (liberals, conservatives, libertarians, fascists etc.)
Lemmy has some very aggressive communists.
I’ve been lucky enough to dodge the crazy right wingers though.
No. It must be lib magic
I’m fine with the lesser of two evils.
Thats a real self own. Do you think you voted away the "greater evil", or libs did anything to make them go away?
You are the lesser evil. And we're not fine with you.
Ok, buddy
I'm not your buddy lib. Why would i be your buddy when you think I'm comparable to a fascist?
I'm supposed to trip over myself to be civil to you when you call us the "lesser evil" to fascism?
Lol
Damn, we found their trigger word! Lesser evil! LESSER EVIL!
It's funny how hypocritical you are right now, too. You wanna label "liberals" as fascist, but get all pissy when the same happens to you with the same amount of credibility.
What's funny is that you lot all seem to fail to realize that "Liberalism" is not inherently left or right wing, unless you are a reductionist who doesn't believe that social liberalism exists and only believe Classic Liberalism exists. You all talk big about your political knowledge and how nuanced your beliefs are, and then you fall victim to the classic conservative notion of reductionism. Seeing "lib" used as an insult around here is just as hilariously pathetic as all the "snowflake" shit
Terminal reddit brained response
I never called a lib a fascist. Liberalism is inherently right wing because its the ideology of capitalism. I understand that there's distinctions between different types of liberals, and between them and fascists. I did call libs like you and the other poster, to use their phrase "the lesser evil" because you support capital but arent fascists.
If you don't like being lumped in with other right wing tendencies then stop supporting capital. Its not our fault that reality is marxist
I enjoyed the whiplash from screaming a taunt at you like the most obnoxious kid on the playground into that detached passive aggressive mode.
And then they broke out the logic pedant terms
Why are you lot so obsessed with reddit? Can't you leave that place behind? I mean, haven't you ever thought that people on reddit talk the way they do because its how most people online in general talk? Reddit didn't invent linguistic trope. I digress.
And what makes you think I am a libertarian? What makes you think I support capitalism? Just because I don't directly support your exact ideology doesn't mean you get to straw man the criticism away. You and your ilk with that and ad hominem, or some other fallacy. Never able to directly hold an argument on it's own merits. It's fuckin hilarious lmao
Can you blame people for being reminded of Reddit when you and your posts reek of Reddit?
Pretentious shit like that is the stench of Reddit.
So far you've claimed not to be a liberal and not to be a libertarian, so if you're one of those very tiresome "I have no political ideology" bullshit artists trying to dodge labels to seem extra enlightened, as seems to be the case, that's actually a move that has overlap with both.
You like it that
It's funny that
It's ironic that
It's interesting that
Reddit minded people like yourself keep trying to mask their rage behind such tiresome "totally not mad" sentence fillers.
Lmao, you are one to talk about being pretentious. Hypocrisy is definitely your watchword.
Also, dont know why my comment said libertarian, definitely meant to write liberal and my shit must have autocorrected. I definitely have a political ideology, and its democratic socialism, which staunchly criticizes Marxist-leninist ideology. Like I said before, I dont agree with your philosophy but that doesnt make me a liberal or right-wing or anything. We agree on a lot of fundamental ideals, but theres a lot of disconnect, too.
I know you folk always have a "you're with me or you're against me" attitude, which makes sense considering your authoritarian nature. I think its just fun how easy it is to set you off. I mean, I can leave one half-baked comment and you guys swarm like vultures! I can see how the gish gallop is so successful.
So you're one of those people that only support socialists who lose. Not a lot of room to talk about hypocrisy then, that's your whole ideology. Makes sense you're also into using logic pedant terms
What are you even talking about? This is the least comprehensible comment I've seen here. Everything you've said here has nothing to do with anything I've said; it's the trifecta of straw man, non sequitur, and red herring. And using terms for logical argumentation doesn't make me pedantic, it makes me able to precisely detail why and how your logic doesn't work. I can see why you are afraid of that.
And, predictably, when all else fails, you basically resort to "no u"
You non-sequitur-ed, you double straw man-ed, you red herring-ed. Its not pedantic unless its from the pedant region of France. This is just sparkling smugness.
Ipso facto absurdeum, Checkmate tankie
I'm sorry that you couldn't comprehend my post, i was being pretty clear. You're one of those western left anti-communists. You dont support actually existing socialist states. You think the men and women of the world who have fought revolutions and built real world socialist projects did it, or are doing it wrong. People like that usually have admiration for socialists who failed to bring a project into the real world, where their actions could be critiqued, where mistakes can happen and be visible, because only projects that aren't real can live up to your idealist vision of socialism.
Mocking you for logic pedantry, and reddit debate bro bullshit to be fair is technically unrelated from your "ideology." But there's an obvious connection to how people who don't find actual real world socialist projects worth supporting would also be into flinging thise terms around like anyone outside of online debate perverts would care
Damn, that's a lot of wrong assumptions about me you just made. I can see that you lack the intelligence to actually see that I never really said much about my own ideology, so basically anything that you just tried to claim about me was pulled deep from inside your anus, and is objectively wrong. For the most part I actually support even communist states, but my main criticism with actual communist states is their authoritarianism, made easy by the inherent totalitarianism of communism.
Big problem with your criticism tho: there aren't any true socialist states that exist today. There aren't any states that have successfully fully implemented a socialist society today. A society where the actual individual workers own and control all the means of production, where all basic needs are met, and people are guaranteed the right to their freedoms. I absolutely support and laud the people out there working to achieve those goals. I don't think any state will ever be able to perfectly achieve those goals, so I don't expect perfection out of my fellow socialists. I do expect the abolition of the class, however, and that has never really even been close to being achieved. Not for a lack of trying, but because there is always some asshole who wants to be above others, and they have been very good at fucking things up for the rest of us.
And, you know, that gets me thinking... this whole conversation is exactly what capitalists want; infighting. You think I'm not radical enough for you, so you then label me as completely opposed to you. The problem is, I can guarantee we share a great many ideals, but you are too busy gatekeeping to allow others with slightly different but reconcilable ideals to be allies.
That is, of course, if I suspend my disbelief that you are a capitalist troll who is spitting vitriol, trying to make communists look belligerent and inhospitable.
Your explanation of your beliefs just proved me right. My thoughts about you didn't come from my ass they honestly came from Michael Parenti Black Shirts and Reds
All governments are authoritarian, its a useless word. I didn't make that up either. Its from Engels On Authority
Totalitarian is a bullshit concept invented during the Cold War to conflate fascism with communism, similar to double genocide theory, to use against communist states. To say its inherent to communism is like saying killing 10 gorillion dead, Vuvvezzuula, no food, no iphone, is inherent to communism.
You believe these things because you're a left anti-communist. You can say that you arent, and then continue to describe to us all the ways that you are again if you want.
No, no it hasn't gotten you thinking. If we share values, then why do you attack us. There's more than once where you've popped off saying something weird directed at us. If you think our differences are reconcilable, why not lead with that?
Instead you started with TRIGGER WORD, and some comment about us being the same as fascists by saying we're like Hannah Montana or something. Then you dicked around flinging out your straw mans and ad hominems and no true scotsmans instead of telling us about your ideology or making a real critique about ours.
Gatekeeping? That was always the issue I had with "democratic" socialists who have
positions, but insist that they're the 'democratic' ones because they want to make sure the slaveowners keep getting a vote (and continue existing).
Shit the fuck up liberal
You really think you did something here with that wall of cringe text
Remind me what happened with Allende yesterday in 1973, and what happened to the Indonesian communists?
You straw mann-ed, you ad hominem-ed, you no true scotsmann-ed, then you mot and bailey-ed
Checkmate to you and your ilk tankie. And its hilarious, btw lol, lmao even
https://existentialcomics.com/comic/9
A stone cold classic
blown the fuck out, nerd
Stop digressing.
Way to drop that mask, chud.
Are you still mad about Anita Sarkeesian's videos, too?
It's funny that
it's ironic that
you like it that
it's interesting that
enraged liberals try to mask their rage behind passive aggressive openers like that.
Who the fuck is anita sarkeesian?
And what makes you think I'm a liberal?
Literally who, amirite
Everything you have posted so far, liberal.
This is their fourth attempt at this comment
deleted by creator
deleted by creator
deleted by creator
You know what I'll take it
Nah I'm pretty sure it's the same reason why Hannah Montana and Miley Cyrus are never seen in a room together
Yes I go into a phone booth as my normal commie antifa self and come out as Chudly Dugsfermpt local pool supply company owner and lover of Milton Friedman
meanwhile in the real world it's liberals and fascists who are joined at the hip https://orgrad.wordpress.com/articles/liberalism-the-two-faced-tyranny-of-wealth/
Wait are you trying to say we're the same people?
Or that the reason is so simple why we're not in the same rooms together that a child should be able to understand it?
I think the implication is we're addicted to a magical potion that transforms us into an evil alter ego who causes mischief in town
And then we get to hang out with Abbott and Costello
Sounds rad
Stop making leftists sound cool
It's just a single monk:
Yeah I might be pushing for universal liberation during the day but at night I put on my maga hat and try to create fun new unjust hierarchies /s
you're either a hilarious poster or a sad joke
yeah sure the people who want everyone fed and housed for free and who require pronouns are right wing.
Yes, every night I stop being a bisexual trans communist and put on my MAGA-Man leotard superhero suit and start ranting about immigrants and the woke gender ideology to people on the street
Almost like the very aggressive communists have a nose for right wing nut jobs and relentlessly hound them until they log out
I think that’s awful an immature behavior. When you fight idiocy with aggression (at least on social media) you just get idiots who think they must be right and start truth social or something
How do you deal with fascists? Facts and logic in the free marketplace of ideas(tm)?
I usually just ignore them.
I find that a lot of crazy right wingers do it to “own the libs” or get a rise out of their supposed enemies. It’s all just a sports game to people like that.
If you ignore them they get bored and stop being so staunch in their awful beliefs. When you fight with them it makes them feel like they’re right. You end up forcing them to rationalize every shitty position.
Almost nobody posts on the internet trying to challenge and reconsider their beliefs, so it’s not like you’re going to change their mind anyway.
I mean that’s what I think, at least
Does ignoring the fascists make them go away? Please.
So now you're accusing us of making fascists more fascist, as an excuse for your ridiculous theory of just ignoring fascism.
Its not even about changing their minds. Its about forcing them out of shared spaces. Fascists should driven out, shamed, harassed, and redacted.
What you think is lib bullshit that gets your spaces infiltrated and taken over by fascists and reactionaries.
You want to ignore them fine, but don't condescend to people who confront them and drive them out of shared spaces as if you have a more "mature" solution. Your solution is literally "if i close my eyes they go away" baby logic
And here we see an aggressive communist in the wild. You have a good day, dude
You said a bunch a bullshit and got called on it. Agressive much tankie.
Fuck all the way off dude
Awe well I still hope you have a good day.
Prime example of libs believing in nothing but self assured smugness and civility. And in the wild no less
lol
We actually study history and read shit. Like I just finished reading Long Walk to Freedom & Armed and Dangerous, both are a fairly good firsthand on how "fascists" respond to non-violence and only start to have reservations when the oppressed shoot back.
Oh and
"The real fascists are the fascists who won't let me fascist 😭"
Cool story bro
Why is aggressive a bad thing?
It’s just polarizing. You’re just making people more staunch in their beliefs or just annoying people who would rather not deal with aggression (like myself)
If your goal is to drive people away and make a space where everyone just agrees with you all the time then it’s effective.
Fascism has only ever been defeated through violence, not through "changing people's minds"
This is really the point to hammer home. Back in my lib days, I started hanging out with a dude who was much cooler than me, and his anarchist friends. We once got to talking about how our town used to have a pretty substantial neo-nazi presence, in the 80s-90s. I said something to the effect of "good thing people are smarter today!" and he and his friends got really animated and saying how "they didn't just go away one day, we fucking chased them out of here!"
While at first I just didn't like getting yelled at, it eventually dawned upon me that that he was right. I, and everyone I had ever talked to about it (other libs), just assumed that that whole unpleasant nazi thing just went away, through the magic of progress, presumably. It was just a thing that was there once, now wasn't. People like him and his friends (and I've since met many more) were the actual people who went out and risked life and limb to oppose the nazis everywhere the went, to vandalize their posters and stickers the moment they went up, to show up in numbers every time there was a demonstration. To do everything to make life as shitty as possible for these pieces of shit until it just wasn't really viable to be a nazi in our town anymore.
That whole realization did a lot to cure me of my "we can't sink to their level"/freezepeach brainworms.
Polarization is clarifying. It drives away fascists which protects their targets and makes spaces safe for them. It also exposes people who would more readily share spaces with fascists and just ignore them than with the people who oppose them.
If it drives away people like you who ignore fascism, yet want to argue that opposing it is immature, then that's a bonus
You save your hatred for those scary tankies because you have not shut up yet.
Literal fascist talking point. "Look what you made me do"
Investigate before you start thinking next time. Are trans children out there looking for fights just by existing or is your belief that fascists need to be provoked first founded on nothing but bullshit?
Thanks for ignoring the people who want us dead, very mature and polite of you!!!!
Yknow I’m talking about on social media platforms, right?
Frothing at the mouth raging at someone on a social media platform doesn’t do anything but cause more radicalization, so I just ignore people instead. I don’t spend most of my life fighting with people on the internet over politics.
Are you deadass actually suggesting that people are transphobic ableist nazis because communists go after nazis online?
or are you saying that it radicalizes more people into avid antifacsist communists, which is an unambiguously good thing (unless youre on team nazi)
This is a real question, please answer.
You won't push back on fascists, but you can't shut up when pushing back against people who believe in pushing back fascism.
Its been pointed out multiple times now that this is literally a fascist talking point. Pushing back against fascism is not what makes people fascist. In fact its how we protect the targets of fascism on shared spaces online or off.
As has also been pointed out to you some people just existing is seen as an incitement by fascists. What are they supposed to do? They can't just ignore threats and the invalidation of their humanity. That you can shut your eyes to that says a lot about you.
They can do whatever they want.
I don’t care what other people do, I just ignore people I don’t think are worth failing with.
And yeah pass judgement if you want, but how I choose to deal with people on the internet is up to me.
Yeah, and you're a bad person for choosing to act this way. Points for owning it though tbh
And yet here you are failing.
Great to hear that the targets of fascism "can do whatever they want." They don't have a choice in the matter of being a target, unlike you obviously.
I've already told you this but our goal isn't to change fascists minds. Its to drive them away, to shame them. To not allow them to spew their bullshit or attack their targets without resistance.
Pushing fascists out of our spaces is the only way people whose existence is targeted by fascism can actually "do whatever they want."
I have no goal here. Just sharing my opinions. Not failing to do anything.
Yeah being aggressive is good for driving people away. And yknow given that your goal is actually to drive people away I was wrong to say it’s immature.
I just don’t like aggression. I don’t go on the internet looking for fights.
Your posts are "just sharing your opinion"
Our posts are "aggressive"
Pure lib shit.
We're sharing our opinions, because of the things you said. Maybe you're not looking for "fights," but you know how to start them
Regardless of handwringing about it, the fact remains that we've driven out and proud fascists off of lemmy instances that we're federated with. The simple existence of hexbear pulls the Lemmy overton window so far left that social democrats are now the right wingers - this is a good thing.
The most maturity obsessed internet people, like you, act like smug adult children while policing the maturity of others.
Are you fucking kidding me m8?
This shit is ridiculous, look at what you posted!!
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Which sounds great until you realize that many of them define right wing nut jobs as anyone who's not a Marxist-Leninist
Edit: LMAO exhibit A below me. "We're not sectarian, they're just not real leftists." Yeah guys, you're doing exactly what I said
You're allowed to be most branches of socialist or anarchist without us considering you right wing, we are a non-sectarian space.
In much of human behavior there tends to be a divide between what we say and what we do. This is no exception
we are highly anti sectarian, youre just a natoid anarcho bidenist, not a leftist
The -oid suffix, as an insult, has a long history of ableism and racism. Maybe you should work on being better instead of projecting your bigotry by appropriating Marxist-flavored gotchas
Im an autistic trans person, but guess some NT Cishet would know more about bigotry than me
I don't care how anyone identifies, you're using bigoted language
You're telling me huh
Im looking through several hate speech websites and I'm not seeing a single thing about what you saying, anyway. Just a single reddit post (ofc) with no linked information.
I am sorry (to myself I guess) for using bigoted language (... to myself? like who am I hurting here besides using language that targets me) and I would love for more information on the subject. If I'm wrong, im happy to take the L and throw such language away.
but here revised:
You are a fake leftist that simps for imperialist and colonialist organizations founded in collaboration with nazis. You are useless to the worldwide movement and no matter how hard you work, you will be doing so in the wrong direction, and would be as useless as you are right now. You use problems of people far worse off than yourself as a shield to help ignore everything you do wrong when you should be using it to look at yourself. You "don't care how anyone identifies" until it is used against you. You ignore the actual fascists and racists because they would not harm you, and you know it. Go take your nonsense to someone who would actually care, you sorry excuse for a leftist. Your liberalism will never be accepted anywhere that has anything more than surface level political knowledge, and that is completely fine by me.
This is just one example
LMAO!!!!!!!!
that gives a 404 error message with a picture of nixon.
And wow, got me, lmao
how old are you? You shouldn't be online so young.
i think the slur filter is catching the end of the url
Idk what's up with your browser then it's hatebase.org/vocabulary/removed
Don't act like your infantile scrawl deserved anything but an equally infantile response
Edit: Since others can't see the link, suffice to say that -oid insults are based on outdated words for people with downs syndrome, and those of obsolete race "science."
Obviously the -oid suffix can also mean "like," but that is not the context in which it is used as an insult.
aight nope you've gone redditor, bye
Oh no baby was wrong and can't handle it
Okay dude
Tasty hexbear tears
seriously log off my guy this is sad
Nah thanks, bigot
too stupid to understand that you were completely owned in that exchange
Or - if you use your brain you'll realize it - vomiting personal insults means absolutely nothing when the other is anonymous online
But they weren't personal insults. They're insults towards your political ideology.
My assumed political ideology thus totally vapid
what?
we have a slur filter with a bad case of sremovedhorpe problem, so we see hatebase.org/vocabulary/removed
Ah, well maybe that's why the link wouldn't work in the first place? Oh well, thanks for explaining. Edited to provide some context for those that can't use the link
https://www.dictionary.com/browse/-oid
Already been addressed, keep up
Keep up? You mean like stay on the page and hit refresh a bunch to stay up to date?
And how are you acting condescending right now? You had this whole long argument because you believed the -oid suffix held the meaning of a slur that used it. You looked up the thing you already thought instead of looking up the thing you were encountering.
Not what I said. I'm saying it's used in reference to multiple slurs because it is. Unless calling me a natoid is supposed imply that I'm like NATO, but it's not. It's meant to imply that people who support NATO are mentally deficient, and so it's a reference to a slur
okay yeah I can see that
Actually it is, we enforce our anti-sectarian rules.
You got a trite truism for every time you say shit without investigating it and are told you're wrong about it?
Here's a bare-bones answer to get whether or not you're a right-winger or Left-winger. I emphasize again, this is a bare-bones answer that's leaving out a lot of other stuff.
Who should have ownership over the means of production, or Capital Goods if you want to use non-marxist lingo. If you say the working class should have ownership over the means of production then you're left-wing. If you say capitalists should have ownership over the means of production then you're right-wing.
Yeah I can get behind this, and I'd say you're right that it's the bare-bones definition of the economic left vs right divide.
But then you have people who will look at market socialists, anarchists, or some other brand of leftism and call them secret fascists or something like that. It's my experience (and yours may differ) that MLs are eager to insist that theirs is the only way and dismiss the rest.
Not all MLs are this dogmatic. But when a leftist is this dogmatic, they always seem to be ML
fake Marxists who ignore the basics of marxist? heck yeah we hate them. I've yet to see any fake anarchists or MLs on hexbear that werent immediately banned tho
What you're describing is the analysis of Marxism-Leninism on other socialist tendencies based off of the historical materialist end results of their respective ideologies. A very simple example of this would be is how Marxists would prod anarchists as being more idealist over materialist over the fact that the more idealist members of the anarchist faction advocate for the immediate and total abolishment of the penal system can't reconciliate the fact that anarchists reestablished the penal system during the Spanish Civil War on their turf due to the material conditions they faced forcing them to make that decision. There's a lot more to this discussion that's being left out with plenty of worthwhile perspectives from all Left factions on the civil war in regards to this and much more.
It's in this regard that marxists will ruthlessly critique all ideological threads and each other all in the name of finding the most materially realistic path to Socialism within their respective home countries - and historically, revolution is the only means to the goal of establishing the dictatorship of the proletariat and a scientific socialist society.
There is not a valid distinction between economic left and political left, or economic right and political right.
There is the left and its various tendencies and ideologies (anarchists, communists, MLs, etc.) And the right and its various tendencies (liberals, conservatives, libertarians, fascists etc.)
If your upset about your ideological proximity to conservatives, it sounds like a you problem
The people I see deploying this take the most are the same people who think Democrats are communists
It's like studying an ecosystem; once you see the fascists, the aggression of the communists suddenly makes sense