Isn't the idea that if you're managing people, you already are constrained in your solidarity with them because when there's a conflict between their interests and the interests of the company owners, it will usually be in your interest to align with the company? Similar to how the police can't simultaneously be the armed protectors of capital and also have solidarity with the people they're policing
Yes. I'm also in that role, as of relatively recently, so I know what you mean. But the powerlessness is sort of my point- you don't become a decision maker so much as a buffer between the decisions of the owners and the employees. Hopefully you get to do some good, but the scope to do so is limited
Yes but you still do not own any means of production. Managers are not a capitalists themselves. Just a useful pion that works against the working class' interests, that's why the capitalists pay them so well.
I see those people as class traitors. Which sound harsh but I think most just do not understand their class interests and/or are basically coerced into oppressing their fellow workers. That's why class consciousness is so important. If you're a manager and you understand the class dichotomy, you will be much more likely to support your own class' interests. by the way, pmc is more than managers. It's basically anyone with a degree and a white collar job.
I agree that it's silly to put white collar, workers in a separate class category. To me it makes more sense if it's restricted specifically to people in an actual managerial role.
Isn't the idea that if you're managing people, you already are constrained in your solidarity with them because when there's a conflict between their interests and the interests of the company owners, it will usually be in your interest to align with the company? Similar to how the police can't simultaneously be the armed protectors of capital and also have solidarity with the people they're policing
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Yes. I'm also in that role, as of relatively recently, so I know what you mean. But the powerlessness is sort of my point- you don't become a decision maker so much as a buffer between the decisions of the owners and the employees. Hopefully you get to do some good, but the scope to do so is limited
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Yes but you still do not own any means of production. Managers are not a capitalists themselves. Just a useful pion that works against the working class' interests, that's why the capitalists pay them so well.
I see those people as class traitors. Which sound harsh but I think most just do not understand their class interests and/or are basically coerced into oppressing their fellow workers. That's why class consciousness is so important. If you're a manager and you understand the class dichotomy, you will be much more likely to support your own class' interests. by the way, pmc is more than managers. It's basically anyone with a degree and a white collar job.
You're gonna cry when I tell you about Engels then.
Is he ok? Did something happen?
I agree that it's silly to put white collar, workers in a separate class category. To me it makes more sense if it's restricted specifically to people in an actual managerial role.
Then why are you supportive of traitors?
Yeah, this one is so bad faith I am not going to bother answering. Read my other comments.
Read some hacker news and then reconsider.
It's harsh, but the only real flaw in the analysis is attributing malice vs just a typical american lack of class consciousness.