Exactly. China is capitalist, not because I say it, but because capitalism has a clear definition, and China fits all those definitions. Socialism also has a clear definition, at least according to Marxists. According to non-Marxists, socialism can be anything from National Socialism to Juche to SwCC.
China is a socialist country because they are pursuing the development of socialism in a Marxist way under the guidance of a Marxist-Leninist communist party and no amount of Chapos disagreeing with the manner in which Chinese communists pursue socialist development makes them a capitalist country.
Marx spent years railing against opportunists who misconstrued what socialism is, and how it can be achieved. Socialism to the CPC means goverment ownership. Socialism as it has always mean to Marxists is the transformation of social relations by abolishing the law of value. This is the key distinction here. The CPC can call itself whatever it wants, it doesnt change what they are actually doing. Understanding reality through descriptors like socialism, rather than the actual content of the descriptor, is the most baby-brained shit ever.
The most baby brained shit ever is actually thinking you’re more of an authority on how Marxism should be implemented in China than 100 million Chinese communists
Little babies like you are unable to handle disagreement, so you resort to the dumbest possible arguments. Is Islam right because 1 billion Muslims believe in Allah? There is no such thing as Marxism, Marx himself didnt consider himself a Marxist, maybe you should actually read Marx to find out why. Communism is the movement to transform social relations in a specific way, by abolishing commodity-production, by establishing direct relations between labor and its product etc. This is what has always motivated communists. The working class, by its very nature, in their struggle against their conditions of existence, and with a concrete understanding of how the world works, will build communism.
China, on the other hand, is a capitalist nation, ruled by capitalists. China has everything that every other capitalist nation has, like wage-labor, capital, commodities, stock markets etc. China is not moving towards socialism, because socialism itself is the movement of an independent working class. Class struggle exists in China, China is not a harmonious society like nationalist propaganda says. The working class in China are exploited, oppressed and brutalized like they are everywhere in the world, regardless of the level of labour productivity. Idiots like you are just nationalists looking to dress up their bullshit in socialist language, either knowingly in the case of Chinses leadership, or unknowingly in the case of braindead rank and file morons like you.
Is the "China building socialism" thing another way of coping with your absolute powerlessness and your inability to understand what actually has to be done to solve your problems? China is building capitalism. Wonderfully so.
It’s literally just what they’re doing. There’s robust debate in China amongst the millions of communists who rule the country about how to best build socialism, they have transparent plans for the same and consistently meet or exceed all milestones they set on the way, you can scream about it until you’re blue in the face, it doesn’t make your “they’re just Norway DemSocs” take any less ignorant and ridiculous.
The fact that you believe this just shows you have no idea what communism is about. Ive seen some of the "debate". On the one hand you have people who want capitalism of private ownership, on the other hand you have social democrats who advocate state ownership. China is just a social democracy. The fact that the suffering of Chinese workers and their real oppression and exploitation either means nothing to you, or is seen as inevitable while they "build socialism" tells me all I need to know about your relation to the working class. You're probably not a member of the working class yourself, maybe youre a dumb student, am I right?
Legitimately it’s none of your business. You’ve been a huge asshole in this conversation and now you’re “just curious” and want to ask me my personal details? Fuck off, jerk.
Im not sure something like "service worker" or "engineer" would be some major personal detail. Anyway, you don't have to answer. I was just asking because in all these debates I've had with """socialists""" its always either students or academics or PMCs or other people infected with petit bourg ideology who try to defend stupid shit like Stalinism, Juche, Rojava etc. Oh yeah NEETs too
No, you’re asking because you can’t “win” the argument on its merits and since we aren’t on Facebook you can’t click through to my profile to find something to make fun of. Again, fuck off. Go be a dick to somebody else.
I have already won the argument by virtue of you not responding to anything I said and just saying "100 million members CPC socialism by 2050 bro". I was really asking out of genuine curiosity.
No you fucking weren’t lol imagine being such a huge ass and then going “uWu I’m just so curious about your life”. Literally fuck off, do not keep badgering me, next reply is getting reported.
Exactly. China is capitalist, not because I say it, but because capitalism has a clear definition, and China fits all those definitions. Socialism also has a clear definition, at least according to Marxists. According to non-Marxists, socialism can be anything from National Socialism to Juche to SwCC.
China is a socialist country because they are pursuing the development of socialism in a Marxist way under the guidance of a Marxist-Leninist communist party and no amount of Chapos disagreeing with the manner in which Chinese communists pursue socialist development makes them a capitalist country.
Marx spent years railing against opportunists who misconstrued what socialism is, and how it can be achieved. Socialism to the CPC means goverment ownership. Socialism as it has always mean to Marxists is the transformation of social relations by abolishing the law of value. This is the key distinction here. The CPC can call itself whatever it wants, it doesnt change what they are actually doing. Understanding reality through descriptors like socialism, rather than the actual content of the descriptor, is the most baby-brained shit ever.
The most baby brained shit ever is actually thinking you’re more of an authority on how Marxism should be implemented in China than 100 million Chinese communists
Little babies like you are unable to handle disagreement, so you resort to the dumbest possible arguments. Is Islam right because 1 billion Muslims believe in Allah? There is no such thing as Marxism, Marx himself didnt consider himself a Marxist, maybe you should actually read Marx to find out why. Communism is the movement to transform social relations in a specific way, by abolishing commodity-production, by establishing direct relations between labor and its product etc. This is what has always motivated communists. The working class, by its very nature, in their struggle against their conditions of existence, and with a concrete understanding of how the world works, will build communism.
China, on the other hand, is a capitalist nation, ruled by capitalists. China has everything that every other capitalist nation has, like wage-labor, capital, commodities, stock markets etc. China is not moving towards socialism, because socialism itself is the movement of an independent working class. Class struggle exists in China, China is not a harmonious society like nationalist propaganda says. The working class in China are exploited, oppressed and brutalized like they are everywhere in the world, regardless of the level of labour productivity. Idiots like you are just nationalists looking to dress up their bullshit in socialist language, either knowingly in the case of Chinses leadership, or unknowingly in the case of braindead rank and file morons like you.
Nice copypasta
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Oh no how will I ever cope with angry internet nerd screaming about China while they build socialism lmfao
Is the "China building socialism" thing another way of coping with your absolute powerlessness and your inability to understand what actually has to be done to solve your problems? China is building capitalism. Wonderfully so.
It’s literally just what they’re doing. There’s robust debate in China amongst the millions of communists who rule the country about how to best build socialism, they have transparent plans for the same and consistently meet or exceed all milestones they set on the way, you can scream about it until you’re blue in the face, it doesn’t make your “they’re just Norway DemSocs” take any less ignorant and ridiculous.
The fact that you believe this just shows you have no idea what communism is about. Ive seen some of the "debate". On the one hand you have people who want capitalism of private ownership, on the other hand you have social democrats who advocate state ownership. China is just a social democracy. The fact that the suffering of Chinese workers and their real oppression and exploitation either means nothing to you, or is seen as inevitable while they "build socialism" tells me all I need to know about your relation to the working class. You're probably not a member of the working class yourself, maybe youre a dumb student, am I right?
No, you’re not right about anything.
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Legitimately it’s none of your business. You’ve been a huge asshole in this conversation and now you’re “just curious” and want to ask me my personal details? Fuck off, jerk.
Im not sure something like "service worker" or "engineer" would be some major personal detail. Anyway, you don't have to answer. I was just asking because in all these debates I've had with """socialists""" its always either students or academics or PMCs or other people infected with petit bourg ideology who try to defend stupid shit like Stalinism, Juche, Rojava etc. Oh yeah NEETs too
No, you’re asking because you can’t “win” the argument on its merits and since we aren’t on Facebook you can’t click through to my profile to find something to make fun of. Again, fuck off. Go be a dick to somebody else.
I have already won the argument by virtue of you not responding to anything I said and just saying "100 million members CPC socialism by 2050 bro". I was really asking out of genuine curiosity.
No you fucking weren’t lol imagine being such a huge ass and then going “uWu I’m just so curious about your life”. Literally fuck off, do not keep badgering me, next reply is getting reported.
oh no uwu dont report me thats literally 1984