So, clearly Israel wants a regional war. What are the chances that whoever the fuck is the US president next year Zelenskyizes Netanyahu and decides to stop sending them weapons? Can a US president even afford to do that?
I don't think it's plausible at all. Unconditional support for Israel is a really important pillar of post-cold-war US foreign policy. Nothing short of a very large economic downturn is going to make the US stop supporting Israel.
Israel allows the US to play “good cop / bad cop” with the rest of the region. Israel is willing to do what the US can’t / won’t do (due to diplomatic and domestic reasons). If you try to go against US interests, Israel is there to make your life hell until you relent. Israel has zero compunction about bombing, slaughtering civilians, assassinating leaders, etc. But bend the knee to the US and then you can be Israel’s “friend” too.
I already elaborated elsewhere in the thread, but TLDR Israel is an extremely important strategic position.
One point I didn't bring up elsewhere is the MIC's blowback job security machine is predicated on endless war, and if the CIA's assets in ISIL or other terrorist groups aren't moving the amount of missiles that Northrop Grumman is looking to sell, Israel is always one phone call away from some psychotic military operation. But I honestly don't think this is anywhere near as important of a factor, especially now that we even saw the US abandon Ukraine to help Israel.
I don't even know if I fully understand the difficulty of cutting ties with Israel, and the more they push the limits the less I think I understand what's so goddamn important about them as an ally
They're at a key strategic position that allows the US to project power into several important targets. Doesn't help that they have nukes so the US can't risk leaving them to fend for themselves without committing omnicide.
You hear about the crying drones thing? That was the reality breaker for me. I don't believe in any kind of elemental evil, but I do now see that sufficient depravity can reach more or less the same depths.
If I was a lich king who had to charge the demon portal with pure evil for my abyssal army to come invade the earth, I MIGHT think about doing the baby crying drone thing.
Yeah: Iran, Iraq, and Syria. They just decided to project that force at 3 countries simultaneously. And if it doesn't work out for them, that's going to be the end of their usefulness.
Not just those, though. The west took a huge L in the Suez crisis, but Israel is a way to still have some control over Egypt (which is more or less a puppet state atm). Israel also sits at an important position for projecting power to Afghanistan (lol) and, to a lesser extent, East Asia. South Korea and Japan are much more relevant for East Asia, but Israel still functions as a hub connecting the east and west.
Israel is the United States' unsinkable aircraft carrier in the Middle East. As current US president Joe Biden said, if Israel did not exist, the US would create one to promote it's interests in the region. That is why the United States considers them important as an ally.
The Palestinian people have, since the Balfour Declaration during the First World War, been the victim of a colonization project by a foreign population, who reserve for them the fate of the Native Americans, whether one acknowledges it or pretends to be ignorant of it. This project has always had the unconditional support of the dominant imperialist power in the region (yesterday Great Britain, today the United States), because the foreign state in the region formed by that project can only be the unconditional ally, in turn, of the interventions required to force the Arab Middle East to submit to the domination of imperialist capitalism.
The Zionist colonial project has always been a threat, beyond Palestine, for neighboring Arab peoples. Its ambitions to annex the Egyptian Sinai and its effective annexation of the Syrian Golan are testimony to that. In the Greater Middle East project, a particular place is granted to Israel, to its regional monopoly of nuclear military equipment and its role as “indispensable partner” (under the fallacious pretext that Israel has technological expertise of which the Arab people are incapable. What an indispensable racism!).
Today to accept the implementation of the Israeli project in progress is to ratify the abolition of the primary right of peoples: the right to exist. This is the supreme crime against humanity. The accusation of “anti-Semitism” addressed to those who reject this crime is only a means for appalling blackmail.
This is a good point. US and Israel deliberately formed a joint suicide pact because it is in both of their interests. For Israel, it ensure the global superpower is always willing to cover for them and defend them. For the USA, it creates a colony that cannot revolt against them and a foothold in the region to exert power from. It's not a coincidence that the Zionist project chose Palestine, located on the Mediterranean Sea right next to the Suez Canal as its location. Israel made this clear during the so-called "Suez Crisis" where they invaded Egypt the moment western imperialist powers lost control of the canal and seized the canal. It is only the pressure of the USSR, and the quick thinking of Nasser to scuttle the canal that prevented this power grab and resulted in a ceasefire. The western imperialists eventually got their way anyway, with Egypt being retaken by their own cronies.
Israel is also located in a perfect position to splinter the middle east and control oil production, and the planned Greater Israel takes chunks out of every surrounding nation (Lebanon, Syria, Egypt, Jordan and even Iraq). It is in a perfect geopolitical location to control the suez canal & a large part of the world's oil reserves. This is why they didn't decide to do their project in West Germany or the US, but in Palestine.
This is the eventual goal of the Zionists, Eretz Yisrael, from the Nile to the Euphrates (and beyond). You can start to see why their location is very strategic, even moreso than Turkey which is often described as in a very good geopolitical strategic location.
Liberal Zionists will call this "anti-semitic conspiracy theories" but it's not, hardline zionists are quite open with their intentions and openly broadcast them. They plan to dominate the arabs, push north until they eventually connect up with Kurds and Turks. They plan to cross the river Jordan. They plan to re-take Suez Canal.
https://www.jstor.org/stable/41144505
Here's a Russian-Zionist hardliner crank's blog where they just give the whole speal right out in the open in 2003, peep how active the comments were this isn't just some tiny fringe.
Reaching these limits is a prescriptive commandment of the Torah. According to the list of Ramban, this is: “The fourth commandment. We are commanded to possess the land that G‑d gave to our forefathers - Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, and not to leave it in the hands of foreigners, or completely uninhabited. As it is said: “And take possession of the land and settle in her, for I have given this land to you, to take possession of it.”
https://avrom.livejournal.com/116574.html
And it's not just cranks who are like this, this is the mainstream position of Likud and Ben-Givr and the Israeli right.
I dug more into this blog, and it's the rabbi Avraham Shmulevich who lives in Hebron, Israel (a settlement) and has a youtube channel in Russian.
All the rhetoric I've seen from the Israeli establishment is full of religious allusions, like some crusader battle speech. So many in the West talk about Israel like they are making rational choices but it really is based on this sort of shit.
Yes there were many reasons that the Middle East was chosen as the primary outpost for the current imperial system and the "first strike" by the US in the 21st century. The same article by Amin states that:
The project of the United States, supported to varying degrees by their subaltern allies in Europe and Japan, is to establish military control over the entire planet. With this prospect in mind, the Middle East was chosen as the “first strike” region for four reasons:
(1) it holds the most abundant petroleum resources in the world and its direct control by the armed forces of the United States would give Washington a privileged position, placing its allies—Europe and Japan—and possible rivals (China) in an uncomfortable position of dependence for their energy supplies;
(2) it is located at the crossroads of the Old World and makes it easier to put in place a permanent military threat against China, India, and Russia;
(3) the region is experiencing a moment of weakness and confusion that allows the aggressor to be assured of an easy victory, at least for the moment; and
(4) Israel’s presence in the region, Washington’s unconditional ally
This may not be a popular view, but I have laid out several times that America needs Israeli war as an excuse to pump dollars into the foreign sector to dollarize the world (Europe is especially hungry for dollars right now). America needs Israel as an excuse for the dollars spent to be recycled/laundered back to the politicians and their proxies through AIPAC. America needs Israel as a forward outpost to de-stabilize the Middle East to entrench US imperialism and disrupt the emerging links from China all the way to Europe.
Israel knows all that, and they are leveraging their own crucial position within the US strategic goals to get the war they’ve always wanted.
At the same time, just like with Ukraine, the US is fine with Israeli lives being sacrificed for the goals of furthering American imperialism. It’s a politically tenable move that is far more preferable to drafting their own citizens to fight in foreign wars.
Also explains the posturing on China and their weapons sales to places like Russia. Stir that up a little and make them seem like a bad guy for basically just doing what any country that produces military equipment does. Meanwhile it gets everyone a little more on edge and ready to make military purchases themselves from your friends in the USA.
Absolutely not. It’s simply political suicide to not support Israel materially. Every now and then you get a pass to criticize them, but if you stop the flow of money and weapons then it might even be physical suicide.
The best case scenario is they plot a coup and install a liberal who’s able to control the fascists and conduct genocide in a peaceful, civilized manner that won’t draw too much attention to the region.
So, clearly Israel wants a regional war. What are the chances that whoever the fuck is the US president next year Zelenskyizes Netanyahu and decides to stop sending them weapons? Can a US president even afford to do that?
I don't think it's plausible at all. Unconditional support for Israel is a really important pillar of post-cold-war US foreign policy. Nothing short of a very large economic downturn is going to make the US stop supporting Israel.
Israel allows the US to play “good cop / bad cop” with the rest of the region. Israel is willing to do what the US can’t / won’t do (due to diplomatic and domestic reasons). If you try to go against US interests, Israel is there to make your life hell until you relent. Israel has zero compunction about bombing, slaughtering civilians, assassinating leaders, etc. But bend the knee to the US and then you can be Israel’s “friend” too.
Israel got so much blackmail it's hilarious
Ain't even gonna mention 911 cause that's verboten but the shit they have done for black ops and intelligence surveillance..
why?
I already elaborated elsewhere in the thread, but TLDR Israel is an extremely important strategic position.
One point I didn't bring up elsewhere is the MIC's blowback job security machine is predicated on endless war, and if the CIA's assets in ISIL or other terrorist groups aren't moving the amount of missiles that Northrop Grumman is looking to sell, Israel is always one phone call away from some psychotic military operation. But I honestly don't think this is anywhere near as important of a factor, especially now that we even saw the US abandon Ukraine to help Israel.
I don't even know if I fully understand the difficulty of cutting ties with Israel, and the more they push the limits the less I think I understand what's so goddamn important about them as an ally
They're at a key strategic position that allows the US to project power into several important targets. Doesn't help that they have nukes so the US can't risk leaving them to fend for themselves without committing omnicide.
I guess maybe I've been spoiled by my media choices, I've come to expect my antagonists to be three-dimensional and not straight-up sociopathic.
You hear about the crying drones thing? That was the reality breaker for me. I don't believe in any kind of elemental evil, but I do now see that sufficient depravity can reach more or less the same depths.
I hadn't heard of this. https://uk.news.yahoo.com/reports-israeli-drones-luring-people-093920198.html
Every time I think Israel couldn't get any worse, there's always more.
If I was a lich king who had to charge the demon portal with pure evil for my abyssal army to come invade the earth, I MIGHT think about doing the baby crying drone thing.
Yeah: Iran, Iraq, and Syria. They just decided to project that force at 3 countries simultaneously. And if it doesn't work out for them, that's going to be the end of their usefulness.
Not just those, though. The west took a huge L in the Suez crisis, but Israel is a way to still have some control over Egypt (which is more or less a puppet state atm). Israel also sits at an important position for projecting power to Afghanistan (lol) and, to a lesser extent, East Asia. South Korea and Japan are much more relevant for East Asia, but Israel still functions as a hub connecting the east and west.
Israel is the United States' unsinkable aircraft carrier in the Middle East. As current US president Joe Biden said, if Israel did not exist, the US would create one to promote it's interests in the region. That is why the United States considers them important as an ally.
This is a good point. US and Israel deliberately formed a joint suicide pact because it is in both of their interests. For Israel, it ensure the global superpower is always willing to cover for them and defend them. For the USA, it creates a colony that cannot revolt against them and a foothold in the region to exert power from. It's not a coincidence that the Zionist project chose Palestine, located on the Mediterranean Sea right next to the Suez Canal as its location. Israel made this clear during the so-called "Suez Crisis" where they invaded Egypt the moment western imperialist powers lost control of the canal and seized the canal. It is only the pressure of the USSR, and the quick thinking of Nasser to scuttle the canal that prevented this power grab and resulted in a ceasefire. The western imperialists eventually got their way anyway, with Egypt being retaken by their own cronies.
Israel is also located in a perfect position to splinter the middle east and control oil production, and the planned Greater Israel takes chunks out of every surrounding nation (Lebanon, Syria, Egypt, Jordan and even Iraq). It is in a perfect geopolitical location to control the suez canal & a large part of the world's oil reserves. This is why they didn't decide to do their project in West Germany or the US, but in Palestine.
This is the eventual goal of the Zionists, Eretz Yisrael, from the Nile to the Euphrates (and beyond). You can start to see why their location is very strategic, even moreso than Turkey which is often described as in a very good geopolitical strategic location.
Liberal Zionists will call this "anti-semitic conspiracy theories" but it's not, hardline zionists are quite open with their intentions and openly broadcast them. They plan to dominate the arabs, push north until they eventually connect up with Kurds and Turks. They plan to cross the river Jordan. They plan to re-take Suez Canal.
https://www.jstor.org/stable/41144505
Here's a Russian-Zionist hardliner crank's blog where they just give the whole speal right out in the open in 2003, peep how active the comments were this isn't just some tiny fringe.
https://avrom.livejournal.com/116574.html
And it's not just cranks who are like this, this is the mainstream position of Likud and Ben-Givr and the Israeli right.
I dug more into this blog, and it's the rabbi Avraham Shmulevich who lives in Hebron, Israel (a settlement) and has a youtube channel in Russian.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Syl-Ouyy7gw
All the rhetoric I've seen from the Israeli establishment is full of religious allusions, like some crusader battle speech. So many in the West talk about Israel like they are making rational choices but it really is based on this sort of shit.
Yes there were many reasons that the Middle East was chosen as the primary outpost for the current imperial system and the "first strike" by the US in the 21st century. The same article by Amin states that:
https://monthlyreview.org/2007/12/01/political-islam-in-the-service-of-imperialism/
The article is from 2007, so a lot has changed since then. But it is still relevant.
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Zero chance.
This may not be a popular view, but I have laid out several times that America needs Israeli war as an excuse to pump dollars into the foreign sector to dollarize the world (Europe is especially hungry for dollars right now). America needs Israel as an excuse for the dollars spent to be recycled/laundered back to the politicians and their proxies through AIPAC. America needs Israel as a forward outpost to de-stabilize the Middle East to entrench US imperialism and disrupt the emerging links from China all the way to Europe.
Israel knows all that, and they are leveraging their own crucial position within the US strategic goals to get the war they’ve always wanted.
At the same time, just like with Ukraine, the US is fine with Israeli lives being sacrificed for the goals of furthering American imperialism. It’s a politically tenable move that is far more preferable to drafting their own citizens to fight in foreign wars.
It’s win-win for both sides.
Also explains the posturing on China and their weapons sales to places like Russia. Stir that up a little and make them seem like a bad guy for basically just doing what any country that produces military equipment does. Meanwhile it gets everyone a little more on edge and ready to make military purchases themselves from your friends in the USA.
Well it's a "win-win" assuming Israel doesn't get obliterated
America basically allowed Ukraine to be obliterated and they’re barely less geopolitically relevant as Israel.
Or bibi doesn't throw nukes at Tehran as a final fuck you
Absolutely not. It’s simply political suicide to not support Israel materially. Every now and then you get a pass to criticize them, but if you stop the flow of money and weapons then it might even be physical suicide.
The best case scenario is they plot a coup and install a liberal who’s able to control the fascists and conduct genocide in a peaceful, civilized manner that won’t draw too much attention to the region.