Today I stumbled across a weird corner of Twitter, where a ton of ostensibly conservative Christian women and men were trying to debate incels and RedPill bros using facts and logic, talking about how they shouldn't shame single mothers or promote having extramarital affairs as "high value" men, and how a TikTok trad wife was a larp of a real adoring wife--who may just have a career and have been intimate with someone else before them.
The women were also trying to redefine an "alpha" as a man who could control his sexual urges and stay faithful and kind, and were criticizing guys worshipping that kicker guy for his commencement speech, saying that if they wanted a homemaker wife they needed to be bringing in his kind of salary. Hell, all the worst fears of misogynist chuds, like how a woman won't date you unless you made 6 figures or had a good body, were things these conservative women were unapologetically saying they expected their husband to have, whereas most secular and liberal women I know would never criticize their partner on those grounds.
And then there were the "nice" Christian men who were showing themselves caring for their wives and trying to insist to incels that this was not "beta simping," along with women criticizing pastors who said DV was not grounds for divorce. All the while incel chuds, for as much as we know they hate feminists, were whining that conservative women were actually the "most disobedient" and likely trying to hide their past promiscuity behind their newfound conservativism. Hell they were even arguing to Mike Cernovich of all people that all women who partied in college were irredeemable.
Not to say these anti-redpill women were totally woke or whatever, they were usually transphobic, pro-Israel, anti-abortion, and claiming incel/redpill stuff was "just as bad as feminism," but my takeaways are:
-
This redpill/incel/trad shit is tearing the conservative Christian community apart and giving their men brainworms too, the educated and family oriented women of the community are actually unhappy with this trend and the potential partners it's yielding, and unhappy with the female incel-pandering grifters facilitating their marginalization. That is not to mention the precipitous decline of conservative male church attendance.
-
The ideal man as described by a lot of conservative women is actually the "beta soy lib" archetype who isn't dogmatic about gender roles and is unafraid to show kindness, provided he knows how to shoot a gun/do yardwork. A left/lib female-attracted person who made videos unapologetically espousing their belief in respect and equality in partnerships, in their own terms, might draw as many conservative women fans as they do trad/incel men enemies. A lot of the talking points we on the left find trite and self-evident would be eye opening in some places if they were just articulated again.
-
These anti-misogyny conservative women are fighting a losing battle and they don't admit it to themselves yet, because they keep quoting scripture to justify their entitlement to male fidelity and gentleness, while the scripture was still designed by men to let married men get away with everything from DV to child SA.
-
These conservative Christian women go at this new wave of misogyny harder than the left does, because the left oftentimes subconsciously steer away from these online spaces for fear of being ratioed and triggered and these women don't have that fear because they are still kind of, psychologically speaking, fighting with their ingroup. It's similar to how the current libertarian presidential candidate was the only guy who appeared on right wing podcasts to unapologetically defend drag queen story hour and trans-friendly bathrooms.
Thoughts? (Also, feel free to repost this anywhere if you like.)
There’s always been a paradox within cultural conservatism where there’s a bloc of hedonists who think the movement will stop the nanny state and pushy feminists from getting in the way of them having a good time, and another bloc that very much so likes the state telling people what to do with their lives. Incels have turned out to be the former larping as the latter. Evangelism as a Pepe/bearded chad meme.
That being said, I think there’s a similarity in both the incels and the evangelical women in that they’re both chasing contradictory ideals in a partner. Incels want women who are meek and submissive, virginal but also will fuck like a porn star on their wedding night, genuflecting to their patriarchal leadership but also not expecting that leadership to do any leading. They idolize being traditional breadwinners but also really hate the idea of women expecting them to be breadwinners; don’t have a job but also if you think I’m going to have a job and pay for things then you’re a gold digger.
Evangelical women, likewise, think they can have this relationship dynamic where men are given the most petty tyrant role possible but then don’t ever act as tyrants. The men must be in control of everything but also those women don’t want to feel like they’re being controlled by the men.
The fundamental problem with both of them is they aren’t seeking relationships with another adult, they want a parental relationship in the dressings of an adult relationship. Incels want a mommy they can fuck, who will be there to wipe their ass and ensure they always have choccy milk and chicken tendies while they play CoD but don’t expect anything in return. Also explains their virgin/w***e complex taken to a toxic extreme, they think they can have both at the same time. Evangelical women want a daddy, a benevolent father figure who ensures all the messy, scary details of adulthood are taken care of, but expect that power to never corrupt.
I'm saving this, great insight
Damn, yeah I need to save this too, just brilliant observation. We really have hit the "You're kissing a girl? That's so gay" stage of male reaction.