It's really frustrating, I was talking to someone about how successful China has been in de-radicalization of reactionaries. But they responded to this by saying they're only successful because, and I quote "put them all in concentration camps and killed them"
Has anyone here been successful in deprogramming people about this topic? If so any good sources I can use to dissuade them? I tried telling them that the UN report, if you read it, just says that there's concerns about abuse by internment offcials, and there's no evidence of genocide. But when I say this they just dismiss it as if the UN is controlled by the PRC. It's like a religion to liberals to believe anything bad about China and can get really frustrating.
These days I just give them the
and tell them to shut up. Pretty much all of the Uyghur libs I know have been complete ass on Gaza and i have exactly zero patience for their fake tears.
Been my experience exactly
No crocodile tears for Muslims when it can't be used in a racist tirade against China
If you go to feddit.org (don't actually, this is just a thought exercise) you will see a lot good takes on gaza but still the uighur genocide lies. They have this one poster who I'm 08.15% sure is employed by NED because of the frequency of the china hating articles they post. But nothing on Gaza, completely abandoned that point.
Pretty cool idea but I feel like I'd like to actually educate people who are willing to listen.
You talking about people you talk to in person or ate you talking about people online?
I don't believe I have ever, and I do mean ever, met a person irl who cared enough about the "Uyghur genocide" to mention it if I'm (lightly) glazing China. Typically it's not even glazing. Just "so... why and how can China, the "inferior" nation, build high speed rail across their massive country but the mighty US can't? Shouldn't we do it too just to prove we're number one?"
There was definitely a solid ~1 year when it was mentioned non-stop online by the same dipshits who will bring up double genocide rhetoric to "discredit" the USSR. Or those who deny the crimes of the Israelis. Or, hell, those who deny the crimes of the objectively worst of all offenders... the USA. But even many "on the left" in the first world are not ready to touch the subject of the crimes of the US/EU/NATO before 1945 and especially since then. It's much easier to condemn the "totally, actually, independent and foreign nation of Israel." And then once you get that, well, they've already admitted to some of the crimes of the US right there even if they don't know it yet. But, I've gone off topic... oh well
There was a post on here a few months ago about a university professor who legitimized the idea in class, even going as far as saying that Uyghurs were not considered a real ethnic group in China (basic, bottom-of-the-barrel lie that even a half-second of research would have contradicted).
The problem with trying this is that the reasoning doesn't go from considering national accomplishments to determining superiority/inferiority, it's actually the other way around. National status is predetermined through a series of racist tropes and everything else is viewed in light of that. China isn't superior because they can build high-speed rail, the HSR network is actually a totalitarian means of 1984 big brother control because China is inferior. The US isn't inferior because they can't build HSR, our inability to do so reflects our spirit of freedom because we are superior.
I'm curious, do you talk to PMCs much? Cause this happens to me more often than not whenever China comes up in conversation even in the most innocuous way
North Korea also gets the most random of strays whenever people talk about something bad that happened
Private military contractors? Yeah, I hang out with the Cheneys every weekend and strategize the future of my company Black Something. That's its name. It maximizes 'nefarious ambiguity'. (I want a check from Eric Prince if he uses this)
Jokes aside, I used to talk to people constantly for jobs, although of course the topic of geopolitics rarely came up. It wasn't something I would bring up for obvious reasons, but I would try to offer what I'd call "neutral engagement" if they did. You can talk about stuff like building massive solar farms and only certified freaks are gonna get defensive over that. My dad's in his 60s and loves solar. Not for reasons I do, but in the end I don't really care.
Usually people didn't know literally anything or if they had heard of the supposed genocide they weren't confident discussing it. I don't blame normal people for being unfamiliar, although I do blame them for blindly leaning on stories while knowing nothing. I think a lot of people do default to "hey, but what do I know?" as soon as they're questioned literally at all.
I assume like HR people and low level managers fall under the title PMC.
I'm pretty good at "reading people" though like how they react to me or things I say. And I will absolutely adapt and change the topics if I detect any chuddery. Stuff like cheap, actually efficient and good solar appeals to chuds though. Or the high speed rail although that is a longer path to travel to get them to see a payoff. Solar is individual enough, or can be and is in the US, that it's like a "no shit, cheaper electricity sounds great" instant sell.
I feel like I'm totally avoiding the genocide stuff because... people don't even know about it say anything. I don't know if that's good or bad??? I guess good but like in a facepalm "fuck..." way. Like the most I ever hear or heard is a general sentiment that "they're bad." The Taiwan warmongering bullshit from the US is way more prominent in my experience. Americans just genuinely, and again this is like a good thing for bad reasons thing, don't give a shit about genocides. Like China could do a genocide for real and no one would care. They only care a little bit about Gaza because it's a "why are we funding this? That seems dumb!" thing for most people. I wish it was for moral reasons, but it just isn't for most people. This probably speaks to another thing I'll cram in then stfu. "Genocide" as a concept is totally and fully misunderstood in the US, and probably a lot of countries but I can't speak for them. People have absolutely no idea what happened during the Holocaust in general, they have no idea that other mass murdering events can be and are considered in the same grouping as the Holocaust, etc. I thought people knew more, but uh, I should just never assume anything ever again.
And NK is treated more as a joke if people ever mention it at all. That's also another country average Americans have not even the faintest shred of a clue about. It kinda makes it easier to persuade people because like if you start talking and have actual real knowledge, maybe bring up some shit on your phone periodically to show you didn't just make up the last sentence, a lot of people seem to sort of default to "uh, sure, dude... ok... yeah, that makes sense. Look, I don't give a shit. Sure, I agree!" Of course that opinion changes every time they hear anything different... so, I dunno, it all feels rather pointless in the end. sigh
In person. It goes without saying the internet is full of shit opinions