Living in Germany truly has felt surreal this past week. I guess I just never had to know how propaganda felt. Of course, there always were apparent biases or dominant media narratives. But I always thought "at least it's not as bad as fox news". I'm not so sure anymore. Maybe I'm remembering this wrong, but I didn't experience the "falling in line" to be that complete. And that includes all the prominent dissenting voices, totally in line now.
This chapo used to socialize as antideutsch in the rotten late Bush years of 2006-2008, and I must say it does feel surreal to me as well.
Wouldn't have dreamed that 15+ years later the solidarity with Israel commitment would be official German doctrine and pretty much everybody I know just ignored all those kids that get blown up by us Westerners every day, as long as the metaphorical burger sauce keeps flowing. White people and Germans sure got even more disgusting in a very short time, and who would have thought that possible after the whole Greece drama and the "refugee crisis"!
Maybe I was a bit too young idk, but I only recently learnt about antideutsche. I had heard of them before, but only had a vague idea what they are and I didn't know they still exist, the whole idea seemed very quaint.
Feel free to talk a bit about them, I'd be interested
Support for Israel is literal part of the German constitution, going against that gets you on the shitlist real quick. It sucks, but when you step far away from curated media narratives, you'll find plenty people who are critical... In a quiet voice.
Lol. I did not realize how strong the pro-israel sentiment is in germany, and was wondering why i got so much shit from my lib friends for calling gaza an open-air prison and saying israel has no right to exist as a jewish state.
I don't remember it being that strong, (I thought 2018 the mainstream position was: oh it's so tragic and complicated) and I have no idea how widespread it really is outside the media and professional class.
It seems like a very german reflex, to prove to themselves that nazism and antisemitism are a thing of the past, they support israel. But anyone who wants to know knows that gaza is an open air prison.
I don't know how representative reddit is, but all majority german subs are hardcore pro israel, even nominally left ones.
While in austrian there are plenty shitheads going " both sides", pro-israel people are generally downvoted. And takes like this upvoted:
Seid doch nicht so antisemitisch, Israel hat das Recht sich zu verteidigen und seinen Lebensraum zu erweitern.
The only swiss sub i could find is extremly cursed, there was one post asking about soli-demos and the comments were full of the smuggest swiss ppl going :
we're neutral, ;-) we don't take any positions
:agony-shivering:
And a few people having good takes.
So the extreme pro-israel position seems to be exclusively german.
germans guilt tripping so hard to looping around and supporting another ethnostate but jewish this time it's very different you see
I've been following /r/de and it's just disgusting the way Germans are discussing Palestine and calling Die Linke anti-Semitic.
Germany is the most neo-liberal country on earth, you get to pick between 3 neo-liberal parties, the fascist one and Die Linke.
I looked in there for like 1 min and had to leave, i don't have any tolerance for that shit.
Yes, it started with the palestine situation in general, that palestinians are mainly responsible for the conflict and all violence is mainstream opinion here.
Although the official police statistics show that antisemitic hate crimes are mainly perpetrated by neo-nazis, it is an acceptable point of view to hold that modern antisemitism is mainly an imported problem from palestinian and syrian refugees.
Anti maskers have been holding rallies wearing a yellow star, and compared themselves to Anne Frank or the Scholl siblings. Their demonstrations have often ignored hygene guidelines or violated general rules, but the police discovered their soft, non-confrontational side.
Allegedly, there was an anti masker event this week, where they played a Hitler speech from loudspeakers, while waving Israeli flags and later declared their solidarity with the state of Israel, while the police watched.
The pro-palestinian march on the otherhand got to experience the "full extend of the rule of law".
They are saying that german anti-semitism(ciritizing israel), comes from arab immigrants.
Ok maybe I framed this post wrong, maybe I was a bit oblivious before. Of course there was a majority behind the "staatsräson" previously, but I felt that this time even "it's so tragic and complicated" is a fringe position.
