I don't know about the sources/citations either but the second one is false. Any wealthy country - or heck, even a middle-income country - could provide generous welfare (or at the very least universal healthcare) without pillaging the Global South.
If a government wants to provide for its citizens it could allocate labor and taxes to give people healthcare. This is true in all Global North countries and some in the South.
"Rich countries can only provide welfare through imperialism" is radlib shit that contains no class analysis. It's Joe Biden style "how are you going to pay for it" from the left.
I'm sure Norway does all the bad shit in the third through fifth boxes (I have no fucking idea, there are no citations), but to say that developed countries can only have welfare through imperialism is anti-welfare, not anti-imperialist. Nordic countries may very well exploit the third world, but their economic model does not require it. It's a subtle but important distinction.
i think you're defending this from the wrong angle, their economic model absolutely requires imperialism to be sustained
but that's the case for every capitalist country in the north, with or without welfare - their whole supply network relies on a price system that sits upon the exploitation of workers and the plunder of resources from the third world, both of which can only be maintained through imperialism
so the better angle is probably to just say it makes no difference, the country already relies on exploiting the third world, this is just about shifting the distribution of the spoils
i mean this is true, i feel like czechia doesnt have an imperialist presence to any great degree, we mostly stay in our little bowl and get colonized by other euros. even then, we have universal healthcare and other welfare options. i think we sent 120 people to afghanistan or something? tbh id have to go talk to some commies next time im there and ask them their opinions on recent czech imperialism. i think our most recent scandal was sending 30 troops to mali or something. most commies just say that we're nato puppets now and do the minimum required to stay nato puppets
I think I see your point - a welfare state is possible without imperialism. I think we can all agree - with socialism being that welfare state. But can we say that the current Nordic welfare states (and other Euro ones) aren’t based on or benefit from imperialism? I’d love to read more about this.
Mostly through imperialism and resource extraction, obviously.
Countries that have not participated in imperialism and exceeding their carbon budgets have also set up welfare states. A country being wealthy or exploitative is not a prerequisite for taking care of its citizens.
It isn't. Death to the West, that goes without saying.
None of this is a defense of imperialism, it's a defense of welfare. Imperial countries will be forced to pay reparations to the Global South after the revolution. But there will still be welfare, because welfare is good.
I don't know about the sources/citations either but the second one is false. Any wealthy country - or heck, even a middle-income country - could provide generous welfare (or at the very least universal healthcare) without pillaging the Global South.
If a government wants to provide for its citizens it could allocate labor and taxes to give people healthcare. This is true in all Global North countries and some in the South.
"Rich countries can only provide welfare through imperialism" is radlib shit that contains no class analysis. It's Joe Biden style "how are you going to pay for it" from the left.
I'm sure Norway does all the bad shit in the third through fifth boxes (I have no fucking idea, there are no citations), but to say that developed countries can only have welfare through imperialism is anti-welfare, not anti-imperialist. Nordic countries may very well exploit the third world, but their economic model does not require it. It's a subtle but important distinction.
i think you're defending this from the wrong angle, their economic model absolutely requires imperialism to be sustained
but that's the case for every capitalist country in the north, with or without welfare - their whole supply network relies on a price system that sits upon the exploitation of workers and the plunder of resources from the third world, both of which can only be maintained through imperialism
so the better angle is probably to just say it makes no difference, the country already relies on exploiting the third world, this is just about shifting the distribution of the spoils
i mean this is true, i feel like czechia doesnt have an imperialist presence to any great degree, we mostly stay in our little bowl and get colonized by other euros. even then, we have universal healthcare and other welfare options. i think we sent 120 people to afghanistan or something? tbh id have to go talk to some commies next time im there and ask them their opinions on recent czech imperialism. i think our most recent scandal was sending 30 troops to mali or something. most commies just say that we're nato puppets now and do the minimum required to stay nato puppets
I think I see your point - a welfare state is possible without imperialism. I think we can all agree - with socialism being that welfare state. But can we say that the current Nordic welfare states (and other Euro ones) aren’t based on or benefit from imperialism? I’d love to read more about this.
Wealthy countries can provide a welfare state without imperialism?
How'd they get so wealthy in the first place?
Mostly through imperialism and resource extraction, obviously.
Countries that have not participated in imperialism and exceeding their carbon budgets have also set up welfare states. A country being wealthy or exploitative is not a prerequisite for taking care of its citizens.
sounds like major *uro cope.
It isn't. Death to the West, that goes without saying.
None of this is a defense of imperialism, it's a defense of welfare. Imperial countries will be forced to pay reparations to the Global South after the revolution. But there will still be welfare, because welfare is good.