Research from BYU wildlife sciences professors finds that when hunting season starts, elk in Utah move off of public lands — where they can be hunted — and onto private lands — where they cannot be hunted. And then, when hunting season is over, they shift right back to public lands.
A happy ending would be the restoration of a food web that prevents overpopulation of elk, I want to rewild the continent so badly, but I don't think that will happen. More effective human hunting to control numbers is preferable to forests losing their undergrowth to an imbalance of ungulates.
I went to Scotland and the deer have done a number on the wilderness because they'll eat tree shoots. So all you get is vast grasses and this red vine shit over rolling hills and mountains.
At their national museum in Edinburgh, they had this exhibit on re-introducing wolves - which would actually work pretty great! That was one thing Europeans always asked me about Canada, have you seen wolves have you seen bears? People long for a natural connection to their lands and know, even at a very deep level, that something has gone terribly wrong with the natural world. Unfortunately, they'd have to re-introduce like Yellowstone grey wolves and not indigenous wolves (because all those were killed by the 17th century) but it's better than the alternative of letting hunters out to kill tons of deer and hoping the deer don't just figure out how to avoid being killed at massive rates.
I've read that there's kind of an impasse to rewilding Scotland. In order to to reintroduce predators, private landowners would ask for the installation of fences, but Scotland has a "right to roam" enabling the freedom of all persons to walk and hike anywhere. As a result, fences are not able to be installed as they would prohibit roaming on public and private land.
I think you might be right, maybe I mixed it up in my head with the exhibit pointing to other successful re-introduction programs like Yellowstone instead of saying it had to be north american wolves.
There are still some eurasian wolves left in parts of eastern Europe and the steppe, I think. They'd be a little more "local" than North American wolves.
Unfortunately, they’d have to re-introduce like Yellowstone grey wolves and not indigenous wolves (because all those were killed by the 17th century)
Meh, at a certain point a wolf is a wolf. That being said, there are still gray wolves in Europe, so we could just use those. Not that it'll ever happen; not in my lifetime, at least.
As far as I know north American wolves arrived in NA at the same time as humans during the last ice age. They've only had 10-15 thousand years to diverge from Eurasian wolves. They could figure it out.
I feel really conflicted about personally hunting deer. They are quite over populated in my area and I know it's fucking up the environment so I think hunting would morally be the right thing to do. I just don't think that I could pull the trigger.
I work in the conservation field. Vast majority of hunters are ethical when it comes to hunting and conservation. They disproportionately support conservation more than anyone else through hunting tags.
I support ethical hunters. But I also really wish we can reintroduce top predators which will keep deer and elk populations at healthy levels.
Yeah I have no problem with other people hunting deer, I let the locals hunt on my land. I just don't know that I could personally pull to the trigger. I'm all for reintroduction of predators but I live in dairy country so it'll never happen.
This is a type of liberalism. The deer individually are cute and nice, but the system demands correction.
Also if you want to start thinking in deep time, eventually ecosystems ought to find a sort of balance. Maybe in ten thousand years humans will all be dead, and our pet dogs and cats will be apex predators, stalking through irradiated forests for feral piglets and monkeys.
I know the system needs correction and it's not going to happen naturally as long humans live in area. I know a survival situation I could hunt but I've never purposely killed anything in my life so it's a question I've been wrestling with. My current solution is just to let my friend and neighbors hunny on my land. But they all want the big healthy bucks which is the opposite of what natural population control would do.
I have looked into getting the birth control darts that some areas use for population control but they don't seem to available to the general public.
The only happy ending I'd settle for is reintroducing wolves across their natural range, ending the cattle and pork production industries, unfencing the west, and feeding everyone who complains to aforementioned wolves, starting with the rancher class of the Dakotas.
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A happy ending would be the restoration of a food web that prevents overpopulation of elk, I want to rewild the continent so badly, but I don't think that will happen. More effective human hunting to control numbers is preferable to forests losing their undergrowth to an imbalance of ungulates.
I went to Scotland and the deer have done a number on the wilderness because they'll eat tree shoots. So all you get is vast grasses and this red vine shit over rolling hills and mountains.
At their national museum in Edinburgh, they had this exhibit on re-introducing wolves - which would actually work pretty great! That was one thing Europeans always asked me about Canada, have you seen wolves have you seen bears? People long for a natural connection to their lands and know, even at a very deep level, that something has gone terribly wrong with the natural world. Unfortunately, they'd have to re-introduce like Yellowstone grey wolves and not indigenous wolves (because all those were killed by the 17th century) but it's better than the alternative of letting hunters out to kill tons of deer and hoping the deer don't just figure out how to avoid being killed at massive rates.
I've read that there's kind of an impasse to rewilding Scotland. In order to to reintroduce predators, private landowners would ask for the installation of fences, but Scotland has a "right to roam" enabling the freedom of all persons to walk and hike anywhere. As a result, fences are not able to be installed as they would prohibit roaming on public and private land.
How truly strange this all is.
"We'd love to save the world but actually the rules say we can't" is my least favourite lib excuse
Just add a gate with a closing spring wtf.
"This chest-high fence absolutely prevents me from going in this direction"
-Scots
"This chest-high fence absolutely prevents me from crossing the country in a totally straight line"
-Geowizard
Fences wouldn't stop wolves anyway. They're smart, and they can dig and jump.
There's plenty of European wolves they could bring in. Grab some from Sweden.
I think you might be right, maybe I mixed it up in my head with the exhibit pointing to other successful re-introduction programs like Yellowstone instead of saying it had to be north american wolves.
There are still some eurasian wolves left in parts of eastern Europe and the steppe, I think. They'd be a little more "local" than North American wolves.
Meh, at a certain point a wolf is a wolf. That being said, there are still gray wolves in Europe, so we could just use those. Not that it'll ever happen; not in my lifetime, at least.
As far as I know north American wolves arrived in NA at the same time as humans during the last ice age. They've only had 10-15 thousand years to diverge from Eurasian wolves. They could figure it out.
I feel really conflicted about personally hunting deer. They are quite over populated in my area and I know it's fucking up the environment so I think hunting would morally be the right thing to do. I just don't think that I could pull the trigger.
I work in the conservation field. Vast majority of hunters are ethical when it comes to hunting and conservation. They disproportionately support conservation more than anyone else through hunting tags.
I support ethical hunters. But I also really wish we can reintroduce top predators which will keep deer and elk populations at healthy levels.
Yeah I have no problem with other people hunting deer, I let the locals hunt on my land. I just don't know that I could personally pull to the trigger. I'm all for reintroduction of predators but I live in dairy country so it'll never happen.
Same, I think I could only fish asian carp.
This is a type of liberalism. The deer individually are cute and nice, but the system demands correction.
Also if you want to start thinking in deep time, eventually ecosystems ought to find a sort of balance. Maybe in ten thousand years humans will all be dead, and our pet dogs and cats will be apex predators, stalking through irradiated forests for feral piglets and monkeys.
I know the system needs correction and it's not going to happen naturally as long humans live in area. I know a survival situation I could hunt but I've never purposely killed anything in my life so it's a question I've been wrestling with. My current solution is just to let my friend and neighbors hunny on my land. But they all want the big healthy bucks which is the opposite of what natural population control would do.
I have looked into getting the birth control darts that some areas use for population control but they don't seem to available to the general public.
Can we hollow out several of the flyover states and allow that to be an enormous prairie with huge herds of roaming wild bison?
That would require all the farmlands to be restored. There’s only like .01% left of the original tall grass prairie. Depressing stat.
Look up Midewin tall grass prairie and national tall grass prairie in Kansas. Beautiful places I love.
Give all the land in the middle of the country back tribes and confine the rest of the population to the coast.
ftfy
Fair enough. I figured giving it all back is unrealistic but so is my idea so might as well dream big.
The only happy ending I'd settle for is reintroducing wolves across their natural range, ending the cattle and pork production industries, unfencing the west, and feeding everyone who complains to aforementioned wolves, starting with the rancher class of the Dakotas.