This is the place for discussion about firearms and related topics. :marx-guns-blazing:
NO fedposting :fedposting:
NO Adventurism :cool-zone:
You will get banned. :stalin-gun-1: :stalin-gun-2:
Be careful not to dox yourself. Talking about and owning guns obviously isn’t illegal, but that doesn’t mean some chud won’t try to use information against you.
We highly recommend using a throwaway when asking for or giving advice that may include identifying information. Using Tor doesn’t hurt.
Thinking it might be time to go get one.
That said, I've only ever shot a gun once, and that was a handgun of some type, about 6+ years ago by this point. What would be a solid first, and most likely only, handgun? I'm not an enthusiast really, so this would be more of a thing "better to have and not need." Looking for something simple and reliable. What's out there, what should I be looking for? Thanks!
First: I will always preach that everyone should have a 10/22.
That out of the way, any of the big-name manufacturers' polymer striker-fired double-stack 9mm pistols is reliable and solid. Springfield XD, SW M&P, HK VP9, Sig P320 (just don't shoot yourself), Glock anything, CZ P10c.
Same can be said for the hammer-fired double stack nines. CZ 75, HK P30, Walther PPX, etc. Marginally more mechanically complicated, usually a slightly cleaner trigger.
Short of it, if it's modern, mostly plastic, if the manufacturer is reputable, and it holds 15-20 rounds of 9mm in the basic magazine, it's gonna be fine. Find the one that feels comfortable in your hand. I'd advocate for sigs and HK in that aspect, because of interchangeable grips/grip panels, you can make them feel good.
Don't buy a Taurus, they go boom when you shake them.
Thanks for the thoughts! What is a 10/22?
Ruger's semiauto rifle in 22lr. Holds between 10-25 rounds per magazine. Works. Is not expensive. Is not a scary black gun.
It is probably the easiest gun to become good with on the planet. You can find parts for them anywhere.
If I ever became an American politician somehow, I'd be running on free 10/22s for everyone.
I think the best place to start is to ask what the budget is? $500 is a good ball park price and will get you a very nice, reliable gun. The second step is to basically just go to a gun store and try on some. See what catches your eye and see what fits your hand.
I'm partial to CZ. My next gun purchase is going to be a daily driver hand gun since I don't have one at the moment, but I've had my eyes on a P10c for over a year now.
Thanks! If $500 is recommended, I could maybe go 7 or 8 for something like this. That should give some wiggle room, no?
I think $700-$800 is a very realistic budget once you start adding in some ammo, a few extra mags, and good little safe or something to keep it in(this is a must if you don't live alone IMHO). I personally don't see much reason to spend much more than 5-600 on the gun itself. Even a good old fashioned G19 Glock is $500.
Cool, thanks much!
Remember to budget for ammo too. Need a certain amount of practice - maybe few hundred rounds minimum? - before gun will do you any good.
:rat-salute-2:
How's it compare to the HK P30 series? I don't know much about how to judge these things based on specs, but that one seems quite similar and much cheaper. My gun-knowledgeable friend recommended that one once when I mentioned I'd been thinking about getting a 9mm.
It's all purely anecdotal, but I think CZ makes very good guns. My husband has a 999, and one of my best friends has a P10c. My friend with the p10 uses it as his daily carry and his gun for for three gun competitions. They both swear by them. I can't say how it handles compared to the HK tho since I've never shot one of those p30s.
HK P30 has the same interchangeable grips panels as the VP9, which I ABSOLUTELY ADORE. When you find the right combination it will feel absolutely molded to your hand.
My partner hates it. The beaver tail is a little low and thick and it irritates their hand.
so this is the rear portion of the grip that fits into the center of the palm? looking at pics it does seem to be a bit bulging on the VP9 compared to the p30, but no idea how it would feel in hand while firing
guess these subtle differences are why folks recommend range time / rentals before you purchase
It's the part at the top of the back that nestles into the web between your thumb and index finger.
And, yeah, the subtle differences add up. I can't stand shooting an M&P or XD, they literally rub me the wrong way. P320, VP9, 1911, heavenly. My partner loves the feel of the CZ 75. Glocks have all the ergonomic feel and visual appeal of a brick, but I shoot them real good, so I still like them.
If you have particularly odd sized hands might be worth going to a gun shop and trying the feel of various pistols but otherwise--- get a glock 19 with this slightly sneaky coupon workaround.
Thanks! That sounds like a bit much and I don't think I'm ready to go ahead and do that, but I'll keep that in mind!
glock 19 is, all other things considered, the go to standard: weapon mounted light is very necessary if you have any intention of using it at night(half the time): Holster is necessary for anything other than keeping it hidden in the house: red dot is critical for acquisition of good set of basic skills and is worlds better than irons: practice practice practice is absolutely essential if you're even remotely considering buying a firearm : best of luck
What's your budget?
Also, are you planning on concealed carrying, or just using it for home defense?
No CC, just home defense. Let's say 800 budget, based on the other person's comment. Hope that helps!
I had to step away from the computer for a bit but it looks like you got some good info in the meantime.
I will say that it's hard to go wrong with any of the popular striker-fired 9mm handguns (Glock 17/19, CZs, Sig Sauers, M&P Shields, Springfields). A lot of it will come down to preference, but practicing with whatever you have is a bigger factor in my opinion. And if one model really doesn't suit you after a few hundred rounds, they usually maintain their resale value pretty well.
If you want a gun that is exceptionally easy to use (but it makes some key sacrifices for the ease of use), check out the M&P Shield EZ. 9mm is a better and cheaper round but it also comes in 380 if you really want to minimize recoil.
I will also say that a handgun isn't usually the best option for home defense, depending on your circumstances and needs. It takes much more practice to become proficient with a handgun than a rifle, PCC, or shotgun. So you might consider getting an AR-15 or shotgun first, if you don't already have one. There's decent AR-15s in the $500-800 range, or a Maverick 88 12-gauge is like $200.
I would need to look up state laws, but....AK47? I feel like that might be too much. We're talking apartments here, in terms of home.
Definitely look up your state laws, especially if you're in a coastal or otherwise gun-hostile state. Key things to know are whether certain features are banned and whether there's a limit on magazine capacity. I believe a couple states even have a list of guns that are allowed, all others being restricted to law enforcement or something of the sort. Also good to know castle doctrine and other defense laws. There's usually sites that show up on a quick google search that will provide a good summary/chart of your state's laws. Could also check out your state gun subreddit (/r/CAguns, for example).
Any round capable of being used for home defense is going to go through multiple walls, whether that be 9mm, 223, or buckshot. Drywall is unfortunately just not good at stopping bullets. The best gun for home defense is the one you shoot the most accurately, which for most people is a rifle before a handgun. Additionally, 223 usually overpenetrates less than 9mm does. Whatever you get, never use FMJ/ball rounds for anything other than range training. Get some good hollow points or frangible rounds for defense.
And as much as I love AKs, there's no practical reason in the US to get one over an AR. Entry-level AKs that don't have reliability/safety issues start at $1k, whereas you can get a solid entry-level AR for $500.
Import laws have ruined the AK market now. AKs used to make sense when they were cheap but now you can get two AR-15s for the price of an AK, or an AR-10 for the price of an AK.
The best HD gun, assuming all other things are equal, is an AR or a similar style of gun in a HVSC intermediate cartridge. Compared to that option, a shotgun is longer, heavier, harder to aim, has worse sights, worse recoil, worse capacity, lower reliability, is not drop safe, penetrates further through walls, is louder, is more likely to cause collateral damage via the 9th pellet flyer issue, and is more prone to user induced malfunction via short stroking. Which if you havent fired a shotgun under stress is definitely gonna happen.
Thanks for the input. Agree about ARs.
I've shot shotguns much longer than I have handguns (since I was a kid) so my experience may be different than people entirely new to guns. Would you personally recommend a handgun before a shotgun, then?
I feel like half of those issues can be solved by ammo selection. But I could be wrong. Also, shotguns seem more effective for community defense and potentially hunting than handguns (assuming an AR is out of budget or not an option).
I am fairly earnestly of the opinion that the AR is the superior home defense weapon in the states. That being said it also comes with the caveat of probably needing earmuffs or a suppressor in order to accurately function in home defense situation. an AR also due to its ease of use and broad effective range also ranks highly on community defense needs. Frankly if youre in the USA and wanna get into AR's dm me and I can help you find a good one/build a good one
I just think a shotgun is gonna require a lot more practice and also any load you have in the shotgun that wont penetrate drywall(I often see fudds recommend birdshot which is turbo illegal) wont penetrate a meat sack either so what are you really using the gun for anyway.
if youre shooting at someone, you are shooting to kill, full stop.
I think if you are really not gonna do anything else with the gun, then a glock 19, decent carry ammo, and oem glock mags is probably the absolute bare minimum for home defense, please at least watch some videos on how to practice dry fire though and get some in depth knowledge on your laws, what counts as self defense, what brandishing is and why you absolutely should not do it, etc etc
Hunting is its own ballgame and im not as familiar with that quite yet.
Yeah we're on the same page as far as ARs go. Really hard to beat the versatility, effectiveness, an usability of an AR.
Been a while since I looked up pen tests, and I don't have time right now since I'm at work, but iirc the right weight buckshot had similar or less penetration than other home defense rounds. But I may be misremembering. I'll check later today.
Mostly just a question of AR > Shotgun > Handgun or AR > Handgun > Shotgun, I guess.
As they say, usually the sound of racking the shotgun is all you need for defense
Remember that dark brandon says it's cool to just fire a couple rounds of 00-buck into the air to scare folks off.
DO NOT ACTUALLY DO THIS!